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#Post#: 82087--------------------------------------------------
Re: Barnet Council. PCN. 31J Yellow Box Junction Nether Street
N3
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: July 22, 2025, 6:32 am
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The time stopped is far too long for de minimis.
Looking back at the other case, I made the point about two lanes
turning into one, which I think is a strong point.
#Post#: 82107--------------------------------------------------
Re: Barnet Council. PCN. 31J Yellow Box Junction Nether Street
N3
DIR By: asm99
Date: July 22, 2025, 8:05 am
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--- Quote from: stamfordman link ---
>
> The time stopped is far too long for de minimis.
>
> Looking back at the other case, I made the point about two
lanes turning into one, which I think is a strong point.
>
--- End Quote ---
Thanks. Should the two-to-one lane merger be argued with any
specific wording? I've read Mr Mustard's analysis of this
particular junction, how should this be included in the appeal?
This is the draft reply:
Dear Barnet Council
Re: AG49267842
I am challenging this PCN dated 16/07/2025 on the following
grounds:
As per the TSRGD 2016, the prohibition of entering a yellow
junction box doesn’t apply to a person who:
(A) Causes a vehicle to enter the box junction for the purpose
of turning right;
And
(B) Stops the vehicle within the box junction for so long as the
vehicle is prevented from completing the right turn by another
vehicle which is stationary whilst waiting to complete a right
turn.
To further quote from the Highway Code:
“You must not enter the box until your exit road or lane is
clear. HOWEVER, you may enter the box and wait when you want to
turn right, and are only stopped from doing so by ... other
vehicles waiting to turn right. Law TSRGD regs 10(1) & 29(2)”
“You can stop in a yellow box junction when turning right if you
are prevented from turning by ... other vehicles waiting to turn
right”
The video evidence shows that I entered the box junction for the
purpose of turning right, and stopped in the box junction only
for so long as I was waiting (less than 7 seconds) behind
another vehicle which was stationary whilst waiting to complete
the same right turn onto Regents Park Road. For this reason, I
am requesting that this PCN be cancelled.
Additionally, there are two right-turn lanes on Nether Street
joining a single lane on Regents Park Road. This has been raised
in previous FOI requests to Barnet Council highlighting the
impact this has on right-turns at this junction. There has been
no modification to the road markings to reduce the incidences of
right-turn vehicles having to stop within the box whilst waiting
for vehicles ahead to complete the right turn, leading to PCNs
incorrectly issued to vehicles which are exempt per the TSRGD
regs.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Yours faithfully,
#Post#: 86773--------------------------------------------------
Re: Barnet Council. PCN. 31J Yellow Box Junction Nether Street
N3
DIR By: asm99
Date: August 22, 2025, 7:34 am
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The initial appeal was rejected. The rejection letter insists
that the right turn exemption only applies when the vehicle is
prevented from completing the right turn due to oncoming
vehicles, which is not what the regulation says.
Any thoughts?
HTML https://i.imgur.com/Ski5OTD.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/oHgKvMS.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/RFuAItE.jpeg
#Post#: 86846--------------------------------------------------
Re: Barnet Council. PCN. 31J Yellow Box Junction Nether Street
N3
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: August 22, 2025, 5:56 pm
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TMA? I say Tribunal time.
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg86653/#msg86653
#Post#: 86854--------------------------------------------------
Re: Barnet Council. PCN. 31J Yellow Box Junction Nether Street
N3
DIR By: asm99
Date: August 22, 2025, 7:01 pm
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For my understanding, are you saying that the wording of the
letter means this is unenforceable?
#Post#: 86945--------------------------------------------------
Re: Barnet Council. PCN. 31J Yellow Box Junction Nether Street
N3
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: August 23, 2025, 3:42 pm
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--- Quote from: asm99 link ---
>
> For my understanding, are you saying that the wording of the
letter means this is unenforceable?
>
--- End Quote ---
Well, Camden cancelled a PCN because of a similar error. DNC.
#Post#: 86948--------------------------------------------------
Re: Barnet Council. PCN. 31J Yellow Box Junction Nether Street
N3
DIR By: asm99
Date: August 23, 2025, 4:29 pm
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Thank you for your input in this. How should the appeal be
worded and do you have any opinion regarding the right-turn
exemption?
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