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#Post#: 81768--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: Enceladus
Date: July 20, 2025, 7:32 am
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I only see one NTO. You said there were two in your opening
post.
The visible NTO has the information on the top right faded out
and largely illegible, did you do that? I assume so, it is only
required to redact or obscure your name and address, please
leave everything else visible. Please rectify and repost. Both
NTOs please.
The NTO that has been posted up refers to an alleged
contravention on the 14th of June 2025. Is the NTO dated the
10/07/2025? If it is then it seems to have been issued
prematurely. Where an on-site PCN has been served an NTO can
only be issued and posted once the 28 day relevant period to pay
or appeal has expired. In this case the 28 day relevant period
expired on the 11/07/2025.
14/06/2025 = Sat = Date of PCN and day 1 of 14/28 day relevant
periods
27/06/2025 = Fri = day 14 of relevant period and last day to pay
at discount
10/07/2025 = Thu = day 27 of 28 day relevant period and date of
issue of NTO
11/07/2025 = Fri = day 28 of relevant period and last day to pay
or serve informal representation
12/07/2025 = Sat = 1st possible day to issue and post an NTO
A procedural impropriety has occurred. The NTO is therefore void
and unenforceable, or have I got the dates wrong?
And what is the date of issue of the NTO for the 13th June 2025
PCN?
#Post#: 81797--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: Archie
Date: July 20, 2025, 1:48 pm
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HTML https://www.imagebam.com/view/ME144C82<br
/>
HTML https://www.imagebam.com/view/ME144C84
#Post#: 81802--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: Archie
Date: July 20, 2025, 2:29 pm
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I have reposted and should now be legible, date of issue for
both were 16/07/25.
The first i ever knew of this vehicle was the 28/06/25 as per my
initial post,it wasnt owned by me nor had anything to do with me
prior and i sent the V5 of with the date i purchased it, I taxed
it online and have had confirmation of the D.D
and I have the V5 with my details and date of aquisition
30/06/25 all appear correct.
thanks for taking the time to help
#Post#: 81808--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: July 20, 2025, 3:04 pm
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Rather like Enceladus, I had to squint to see the date of issue.
OP, this isn't going away unless you can produce proof as to why
you may not be considered to be the person liable. In
particular, will you pl address the issue of why DVLA have your
detsils as the registered keeper on the relevant date.
#Post#: 81818--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: Enceladus
Date: July 20, 2025, 3:43 pm
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--- Quote from: Archie link ---
>
>
> ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
> On a side note, some time between january and my purchase on
30th June this vehicle must have incured a ULEZ charge ?
> and as i dont know the rules around this, are vehicles charged
for every day they are parked within the zone on a public road
or only when they move within this zone ?
>
> ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
>
>
--- End Quote ---
OK forget the premature NTO possibility, I can now see the date
of the NTO is the 16th July, not the 10th.
We still need to see the NTO for the 13th June PCN?
The car would only have incurred a ULEZ charge on days it had
been used (moving) within the ULEZ zone, assuming it had passed
/ triggered an enforcement camera. If it has been parked up
legally and not moved then no ULEZ charge or other charges would
have been incurred.
What makes you think there must have been a ULEZ charge prior to
purchase?
If the intermediate owner, somebody apparently not registered
with the DVLA, has been using the car within Greater London,
then it wouldn't surprise me me if there are multiple PCNs
outstanding for various infringements. Of course most of these
should/would have gone to the person named on the V5c that you
had. At least until he/she informed the DVLA that they were no
longer the owner.
I feel inclined to put the onus on Ealing to explain why they
have served NTOs on you in relation to alleged contraventions
that occurred before you became the RK. So perhaps keep it
simple and don't get into a convoluted history. Save that for
the Adjudicator.
Something like:
Re: PCN xyz111 and xyz222
VRM ABC123
I was not the owner of this vehicle on the dates of these
contraventions.
I purchased the car on the 30th June 2025.
The DVLA record confirms that I acquired the car on the 30th
June 2025.
Attached is a copy of the latest V5c registration document
confirming that I acquired the car on the 30th June 2025.
Clearly I cannot be held responsible for any parking
contraventions that occurred before I acquired the car.
I can only assume that some error has occurred within your
Penalty Charge Notice processing systems and that these Notices
to Owner were served on me by mistake.
Please cancel these Notices to Owner.
I look forward to your confirmation of cancellations and that
these matters are now closed.
Yours
#Post#: 81854--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: Archie
Date: July 21, 2025, 1:50 am
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Thank you will post as above, should I send hard copy and
electronic ?
Thanks Archie
#Post#: 81861--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: July 21, 2025, 2:35 am
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Could someone square this circle pl:
If 'The DVLA record confirms that I acquired the car on the 30th
June 2025.' then why/how was the council given your details by
DVLA as being the RK on the date of the contravention?
#Post#: 81871--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: Enceladus
Date: July 21, 2025, 4:09 am
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--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> Could someone square this circle pl:
>
> If 'The DVLA record confirms that I acquired the car on the
30th June 2025.' then why/how was the council given your details
by DVLA as being the RK on the date of the contravention?
>
--- End Quote ---
Who knows? Let Ealing enlighten us.
I can imagine how it might have happened, but thus far there is
no firm evidence. And there may never be.
On the other hand the OP has a V5c issued on the 10th July that
says he acquired the vehicle on the 30th June and that is firm
evidence. So let Ealing refute it if they can.
#Post#: 81879--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: July 21, 2025, 5:06 am
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If the council were provided with the OP's details by DVLA as
being the registered keeper on the relevant date then IMO the
burden is the OP's not the council's.
Acquiring a vehicle and being the registered keeper are not
necessarily related. A person could be the RK but not own a
vehicle(V5C is not a certificate of ownership) and vice-versa.
#Post#: 81907--------------------------------------------------
Re: notice to owner (ealing)
DIR By: Enceladus
Date: July 21, 2025, 6:50 am
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--- Quote from: Archie link ---
>
> Thank you will post as above, should I send hard copy and
electronic ?
> Thanks Archie
>
--- End Quote ---
Use the "Make a Challenge/Representation option on the online
form on the Ealing website to submit. Once for each PCN although
you could x-ref both PCNs to each other in the text of the
challenges.
Take screen prints of what you submit. The entire pages, so
scroll down if needs be. And don't forget to upload a PDF scan
or JPEG photos of the new V5c.
I don't know about Ealing in particular but I would expect that
you should get emailed acknowledgements within minutes.
So you shouldn't need to submit hard copies.
@ Archie
I also suggest that you email a Subject Access Request to the
DVLA
HTML https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/62692f63d3bf7f0e7d5b3dc6/make-a-subject-access-request-to-dvla-form-mis1065_270422.pdf.<br
/>Fill in the form and then attach to an email to the address
provided. See the instructions at the bottom of the form.
Ask the DVLA for copies of any requests made for the Registered
Keeper's details together with the dates, times and means by
which they were received.
And ask for copies of the responses the DVLA supplied and their
dates, times and means of transmission.
I doubt if they'll give you anything in respect of dates prior
to the 30th June 2025. But let's see what you get back.
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