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#Post#: 78723--------------------------------------------------
Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: Trousers37 Date: June 28, 2025, 4:41 pm
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Seeking support in relation to the below matter.
Last year keeper of vehicle received a PCN from Alliance Parking
at Trevino beach. Parking was paid by non keeper of car and can
be evidenced on bank statement. There was a delay returning to
the car resulting in an overstay of 10/20 mins (exact time not
known as purchased ticket not kept)
Keeper did not take picture of parking signs but found this
picture online (also see attached)
HTML https://www.searchforsites.co.uk/image.php?src=24897_1632245139_app.jpg
The keeper appealed the PCN as follows:
“ I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle.
I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be
making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client
landowner.
There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no
assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I
require an explanation of the allegation and your evidence. You
must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you
contend was at the location on the material date as well as your
images of the vehicle.
If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in
response to this appeal must include the record of payments made
- showing partial VRNs - and an explanation of the reason for
the PCN, because your Notice does not explain it.
If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your
evidence must include the actual grace period agreed by the
landowner.”
The keeper received letters from Trace and more recently
Moorside legal chasing payment but they have been ignored.
Last week a letter of claim was received from moorside, dated 18
June.
Any advice on how to respond would be much appreciated
Thanks
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 78770--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: b789 Date: June 29, 2025, 7:10 am
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Respond to the LoC by email to help@moorsidelegal.co.uk and also
CC in yourself, with the following:
[quote]Dear Sirs,
Your Letter Before Claim contains insufficient detail of the
claim and fails to provide copies of evidence your client places
reliance upon and thus is in complete contravention of the
Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims.
I am the registered keeper of the vehicle. I am not obliged to
identify the driver and I decline to do so. As there is no legal
presumption that the keeper of a vehicle was its driver on any
particular occasion, your client cannot pursue me as driver as
per VCS v Edward (2023) [H0KF6C9C]
HTML https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/yvxek3kfwtb3qent3lj6y/VCS-Limited-v-Ian-Mark-Edward-H0KF6C9C.pdf?rlkey=niecohfdtj1n1ysh5prbsp52p&e=1&dl=0.
As your client cannot pursue me as driver or keeper, it would be
an abuse of the court’s process for your client to issue a claim
against me and I will defend any such claim vigorously and seek
costs in relation to your client’s unreasonable and vexatious
conduct under Part 27.14(2)(g)
Because your letter lacks specificity and breaches the
requirements of the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims
(paragraphs 3.1(a)-(d), 5.1 and 5.2) as well as the Practice
Direction - Pre-Action Conduct (paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c)), you
must treat this letter as a formal request for all of the
documents/information that the protocol now requires your client
to provide. Your client must not issue proceedings without
complying with that protocol.
As solicitors you must surely be familiar with the requirements
of both the Practice Direction and the Pre-Action Protocol for
debt claims and your client, as a serial litigator of debt
claims, should likewise be aware of them. As you (and your
client) must know, the Practice Direction and Protocol bind all
potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its
express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim
and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable
parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a
settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the
costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time. It
is embarrassing that a firm of Solicitors are sending a consumer
a vague and un-evidenced 'Letter of Claim' in complete ignorance
of the pre-existing Practice Direction and the Pre-Action
Protocol.
I confirm that, once I am in receipt of a Letter Before Claim
that complies with the requirements of para 3.1 (a) of the
Pre-Action Protocol, I shall then seek advice and submit a
formal response within 30 days, as required by the Protocol.
Thus, I require your client to comply with its obligations by
sending me the following information/documents:
[indent]1. An explanation of the cause of action
2. whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of
POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are; for how long it is claimed
the vehicle was parked, how the monies being claimed arose and
have been calculated
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the
date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and
provide to me a copy of that contract.
6. If the claim is for a contractual breach, photographs showing
the vehicle was parked in contravention of said contract.
7. Is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
8. Provide me a copy of the contract with the landowner under
which they assert authority to bring the claim, as required by
the BPA/IPC Private Parking Single Code of Practice (PPSCoP).
9. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
10. Photographs of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of
font, height at which displayed) at the time of any alleged
contravention.
11. Provide details of the original charge, and detail any
interest and administrative or other charges added
12. Am I to understand that the additional £70 represents what
is dressed up as a 'Debt Recovery' fee, and if so, is this nett
or inclusive of VAT? If the latter, would you kindly explain why
I am being asked to pay the operator’s VAT?
13. With regard to the principal alleged PCN sum: Is this
damages, or will it be pleaded as consideration for
parking?[/indent]
I am clearly entitled to this information under paragraphs 6(a)
and 6(c) of the Practice Direction. I also need it in order to
comply with my own obligations under paragraph 6(b).
If your client does not provide me with this information then I
put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of Webb
Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch),
Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part
20) Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church
Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann
Limited [2007] EWHC 855 in asking the court to impose sanctions
on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant
to paragraphs 13, 15(b) and (c) and 16 of the Practice
Direction, as referred to in paragraph 7.2 of the Protocol.
Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided
this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged
claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is
entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for
your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then
I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the
Practice Direction and an order that this information is
provided.
Yours faithfully,
[Your name][/quote]
#Post#: 78814--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: Trousers37 Date: June 29, 2025, 4:14 pm
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Thanks so much for the advice.
Will send across today.
Out of interest - what are the likely next steps after this?
#Post#: 78829--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: b789 Date: June 30, 2025, 1:53 am
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A claim will be issued. We will provide a suitable defence and
advice on how to submit that when you show us the N1SDT Claim
Form with the Particulars of Claim (PoC). When you do, you only
need to redact your personal info, the claim number and the MCOL
password. ALL dates must be left visible.
AS the incompetents at Moorside Legal will fail to comply with
the PAP, you should also report them to the SRA.
#Post#: 78831--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: Trousers37 Date: June 30, 2025, 1:59 am
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Thanks appreciate that
Just for my clarification, the letter of claims asks for £170.
In the suggested response above:
“ 12. Am I to understand that the additional £70 represents what
is dressed up as a 'Debt Recovery' fee, and if so, is this nett
or inclusive of VAT? If the latter, would you kindly explain why
I am being asked to pay the operator’s VAT?”
Is the additional £70 a standard uplift that is applied to
Alliance’s PCN notice? (Sorry don’t have original letters to
hand at the moment as away)
Thanks
#Post#: 78834--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: b789 Date: June 30, 2025, 2:16 am
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Yes, we know. The charge in the PCN was for £100. They have
added a fake additional £70 to that sum, hence the claim is now
for £170.
#Post#: 90460--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: Trousers37 Date: September 18, 2025, 2:25 am
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Hi
Keeper of vehicle received an email from Moorside asking:
“To enable us to process your email, we need to confirm that we
are corresponding with the correct individual. To pass our
security checks, we ask that you confirm the following:
Address and post code
Vehicle registration
Please reply to this email to continue the email thread.”
Assume no issue for the keeper to provide this information?
Thanks
#Post#: 90486--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: b789 Date: September 18, 2025, 6:22 am
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Is that the full response you have had to the response I advised
you to send a couple of months ago? I doubt it, so please show
their full response.
#Post#: 90488--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: b789 Date: September 18, 2025, 6:30 am
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You can respond with the following:
[quote]Subject: Re: Your so-called “security checks” – [Your
ref]
Dear Sirs,
It beggars belief that your firm, having sent me a Letter of
Claim to my correct address and clearly holding my vehicle
details, now demands that I “pass security” by confirming the
very information you already possess. Such conduct typifies the
incompetence for which you are becoming notorious.
Let me be absolutely clear: I will not be using any so-called
“portal”. You may communicate with me by email or by post, at
your discretion. Any further attempts to impose artificial
obstacles to correspondence will simply be treated as further
evidence of unreasonable conduct and brought to the court’s
attention in due course.
You are required to cease these time-wasting antics and provide
a full and substantive response to my letter of [date], in
strict compliance with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims.
Should your client proceed to issue proceedings without first
complying with their obligations, I will seek an immediate stay
under the Practice Direction – Pre-Action Conduct (paragraph
15(b)) and invite the court to impose sanctions.
Yours faithfully,
[Name][/quote]
#Post#: 90569--------------------------------------------------
Re: Alliance Parking PCN - Trevone Beach - Overstay
By: Trousers37 Date: September 18, 2025, 5:02 pm
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Correct. That’s what they have responded with.
No correspondence received in the post. This is first point of
contact received after sending the detailed reply as
recommended.
The email is a reply to that response sent to Moorside by email.
And simply says
“ Thank you for your email.
To enable us to process your email, we need to confirm that we
are corresponding with the correct individual. To pass our
security checks, we ask that you confirm the following:
Address and post code
Vehicle registration
Please reply to this email to continue the email thread.
Yours sincerely
Moorside Legal”
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