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#Post#: 78634--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: June 28, 2025, 6:10 am
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The location given in the PCN is: The Town EN2 Box Junction
The NOR states: 'we would also state that....we consider your
approach to the box junction to be from Southbury Road.' Now,
they said this to counter your argument about turning right i.e.
you weren't because this manoeuvre had already been completed.
In which case, why is the location not given as Southbury Road
as the contravention must have occurred wholly in this road!
#Post#: 78683--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: MachineGunJoe
Date: June 28, 2025, 12:34 pm
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--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> The location given in the PCN is: The Town EN2 Box Junction
>
> The NOR states: 'we would also state that....we consider your
approach to the box junction to be from Southbury Road.' Now,
they said this to counter your argument about turning right i.e.
you weren't because this manoeuvre had already been completed.
In which case, why is the location not given as Southbury Road
as the contravention must have occurred wholly in this road!
>
--- End Quote ---
Yes, they seem to have confused themselves there. At tribunal
would they take that into account, or it is solely based on the
details of the original PCN?
#Post#: 78686--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: mickR
Date: June 28, 2025, 12:42 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> The location given in the PCN is: The Town EN2 Box Junction
>
> The NOR states: 'we would also state that....we consider your
approach to the box junction to be from Southbury Road.' Now,
they said this to counter your argument about turning right i.e.
you weren't because this manoeuvre had already been completed.
In which case, why is the location not given as Southbury Road
as the contravention must have occurred wholly in this road!
>
--- End Quote ---
yes they are talking bo!!ox it is impossible to "approach" the
box junction from southbury road as the box starts at the
beginning of S Rd. you can only approach from The town, Silver
street or as the OP did London Road.
I think you will find that very oddly the left side is southbury
Rd and the right side The Town. possibly the street name has
been placed at the wrong point.
#Post#: 78835--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: MachineGunJoe
Date: June 30, 2025, 2:19 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: mickR link ---
>
>
> yes they are talking bo!!ox it is impossible to "approach" the
box junction from southbury road as the box starts at the
beginning of S Rd. you can only approach from The town, Silver
street or as the OP did London Road.
> I think you will find that very oddly the left side is
southbury Rd and the right side The Town. possibly the street
name has been placed at the wrong point.
>
--- End Quote ---
I will mention this impossibility in my tribunal appeal - but
would it count for anything with the adjudicator as it was
written in the NOR, not the original PCN?
#Post#: 79708--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: MachineGunJoe
Date: July 5, 2025, 12:32 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
A gentle bump as it’s been just over a week since I first
posted. Would appreciate a sense check that what I’ve written in
my first appeal is fine and there’s nothing more to add before I
begin the tribunal process. Many thanks
#Post#: 79730--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: July 5, 2025, 4:01 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I will mention this impossibility in my tribunal appeal - but
would it count for anything with the adjudicator as it was
written in the NOR, not the original PCN?
??
The fact that the PCN does NOT give the location as Southbury is
the key. The council want their cake and eat it too.
The idiom "wanting to have your cake and eat it too" means
wanting to enjoy the benefits of two incompatible things at the
same time. It's used to describe situations where someone
desires to have it both ways, without facing the negative
consequences of either option.
If you were in The Town then your argument of turning right has
merit. If they now claim that you were not in The Town but
instead Southbury then the PCN is incorrect.
#Post#: 79783--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: MachineGunJoe
Date: July 6, 2025, 9:21 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Understood. Will spell that out too - thanks for your advice.
#Post#: 83250--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: MachineGunJoe
Date: July 29, 2025, 5:06 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Updating to say tribunal is scheduled for 6 October. Will update
with outcome after.
#Post#: 83282--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: July 29, 2025, 7:01 am
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1. I make this collateral challenge as the PCN does not state
mandatory information as follows provided @ Paras. 4(8 ) (v)
which in turn relates to (iii)
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2003/3/section/4/enacted
Therefore, the PCN is not valid as it is missing mandatory
information. Do you want representation? But I am in Kos that
day.
#Post#: 93202--------------------------------------------------
Re: Enfield - 31J Entering and stopping in a box junction, The
Town EN2
DIR By: MachineGunJoe
Date: October 7, 2025, 5:49 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Updating to say I had my tribunal yesterday and my appeal was
allowed.
However I’ve now found myself in a weird situation where the
tribunal has incorrectly logged the outcome as “appeal refused”.
The direction says “Cancel the PCN” and the last line of the
adjudicator’s comments says “The appeal is allowed.”
I called London Tribunals who said they will refer to the case
manager to correct, however the letter I’ll receive regarding
the outcome will say the appeal has both been refused and
allowed.
My concern is the council will see “appeal refused” and send a
letter demanding payment, causing wasted time and effort on my
part to resolve. I’ve tried calling the council’s parking
enforcement team twice - both times cut off after being on hold
after 20mins.
Has this happened to anyone else?
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