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#Post#: 77819--------------------------------------------------
Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: MrNeo
Date: June 23, 2025, 5:28 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Hello everyone,<br><br>
Please I need urgent advice for a PCN that was never received.
The first letter received was a Notice of enforcement (NoE) at
bailiff stage, no PCN, no else for 13 months.
<br><br>
Summary:<br>
- PCN Type: Moving Traffic - road civil offence wrong turn CCTV
- East London A13<br>
- Date & applicant: 24 May 2024 - London Borough of Newham.<br>
- Core Issue: the respondent did not receive the original PCN or
any subsequent correspondence (Notice to Owner, Charge
Certificate, Order for Recovery, etc.).<br>
- Reason for Non-Receipt: just after the offence on 24 May 2024,
The respondent changed address twice and updated the V5c log
book twice (10 June 2024) and (11 July 2024). The respondent
have been living in the same accommodation since then (almost 1
year to date). The respondent only became aware of the
outstanding PCN on 19 June 2025, upon finding a Notice of
Enforcement (NoE) dated 15 May 2025 to be paid by 26 May 2025.
<br><br>
Action taken:<br>
- The original amount of £280 asked just few days ago, has not
being paid. Instead the PE2 and PE3 "out of time" statutory
declaration has been sent to the Traffic Enforcement Centre
(TEC) and the bailiff officer informed of the above.<br>
- Both PE2 (Application to file a statutory declaration out of
time) and PE3 (Statutory Declaration) forms were sworn by a
solicitor and immediately emailed along with comprehensive
supporting evidence (DVLA confirmation emails, screenshots of
V5C updates, driving licence address change confirmations, car
insurance letter, landlord letter confirming residence) to
TEC.<br><br>
- Bailiff Action: despite being informed of this via post and
via email, just few days after on 23 June 2025, a bailiff
hand-delivered the Enforcement Notice at the reception desk
where the respondent lives. The total to pay is now updated at
£515.<br><br>
I anticipate the council will oppose the respondent application,
citing that the PCN was sent to the DVLA-registered address, was
not returned by Royal Mail (therefore "deemed served"), and
arguing it's the keeper's responsibility to manage mail.<br><br>
My Understanding of Current Status is:<br>
- Enforcement by the bailiffs should now be suspended while the
TEC processes my "out of time" application.<br>
- The TEC will either reject or approve this
application.<br><br>
Few questions:
- Given the large number of evidence (especially the proactive
DVLA updates before the PCN was issued) and the detailed
explanation given, how strong do you think this good reason for
an "out of time" application is?<br>
- If the TEC Court Officer denies this application, what are the
key arguments or focus points should be used for the subsequent
N244 application to a District Judge? Are there common pitfalls
to avoid at that stage?<br>
- Are there any other specific legal points or regulations that
applies to this case?<br><br>
Thank you for any advice you can offer.
#Post#: 77823--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: Enceladus
Date: June 23, 2025, 5:52 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Please read the READ THIS FIRST - **BEFORE POSTING YOUR CASE!**
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/<br
/>sticky post at the top of the forum.
Please post up a scan or photo of the Notice to Enforcement from
the bailiff. Just redact your name and address, please leave
everything else visible.
Is the name name and address on the Notice of Enforcement 100%
correct and current?
"The respondent only became aware of the outstanding PCN on 19
June 2025, upon finding a Notice of Enforcement (NoE) dated 15
May 2025 to be paid by 26 May 2025."
What do you mean. Where did you find the NoE?
The Out of Time application will have been forwarded to Newham
who may well object to the application. What reasons did you
give, for being late with the Statutory Declaration, on the OOT?
#Post#: 77847--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: June 24, 2025, 4:02 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Both PE2 (Application to file a statutory declaration out of
time) and PE3 (Statutory Declaration) forms were sworn by a
solicitor and immediately emailed along with comprehensive
supporting evidence (DVLA confirmation emails, screenshots of
V5C updates, driving licence address change confirmations, car
insurance letter, landlord letter confirming residence) to
TEC.<br><br>
- Bailiff Action: despite being informed of this via post and
via email, just few days after on 23 June 2025, a bailiff
hand-delivered the Enforcement Notice at the reception desk
where the respondent lives. The total to pay is now updated at
£515.
Much too vague I'm afraid. This process is about dates and
times.
You submitted your OOT when exactly?
The date on the enforcement notice hand-delivered is?
The name and address are yours, yes?
#Post#: 78016--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: MrNeo
Date: June 24, 2025, 3:29 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Enceladus link ---
>
> Please read the READ THIS FIRST - **BEFORE POSTING YOUR
CASE!**
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/<br
/>sticky post at the top of the forum.
>
> Please post up a scan or photo of the Notice to Enforcement
from the bailiff. Just redact your name and address, please
leave everything else visible.
>
> Is the name name and address on the Notice of Enforcement 100%
correct and current?
>
> "The respondent only became aware of the outstanding PCN on 19
June 2025, upon finding a Notice of Enforcement (NoE) dated 15
May 2025 to be paid by 26 May 2025."
> What do you mean. Where did you find the NoE?
>
> The Out of Time application will have been forwarded to Newham
who may well object to the application. What reasons did you
give, for being late with the Statutory Declaration, on the OOT?
>
--- End Quote ---
thanks for your reply. I will try to post a picture of that
document, however I would prefer remove further details at this
very early stage.
Regarding your questions the reason given is summarized in POST
#1. Other additional details are confidential in nature for the
respondent.
The notice was a simple ordinary white blank letter . Not sure
if first class or second class. It doesn't have a stamp.
#Post#: 78023--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: MrNeo
Date: June 24, 2025, 3:49 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> Both PE2 (Application to file a statutory declaration out of
time) and PE3 (Statutory Declaration) forms were sworn by a
solicitor and immediately emailed along with comprehensive
supporting evidence (DVLA confirmation emails, screenshots of
V5C updates, driving licence address change confirmations, car
insurance letter, landlord letter confirming residence) to TEC.
>
>
> - Bailiff Action: despite being informed of this via post and
via email, just few days after on 23 June 2025, a bailiff
hand-delivered the Enforcement Notice at the reception desk
where the respondent lives. The total to pay is now updated at
£515.
>
> Much too vague I'm afraid. This process is about dates and
times.
>
> You submitted your OOT when exactly?
>
> The date on the enforcement notice hand-delivered is?
>
> The name and address are yours, yes?
>
--- End Quote ---
Hi. I can try to be more detailed:
Timeline 2024
-------------
road traffic offence dated (based on the NoE): 24/05/2024
relocated/move home (1st time): 07/06/2024
DVLA V5C request to update sent: 10/06/2024 (1 business days
after entering new accommodation)
relocated/move home (2nd time): 29/06/2024
DVLA V5C request to update sent: 11/07/2024 (8 business days
after entering new accommodation)
Enforment Officer instructed to enforce PCN by TEC (as written
on NoE letter): 01/11/2024
Timeline 2025
-------------
NoE letter issued (as written on the NoE letter): 15/05/2025 to
pay by: 26/05/2025
NoE letter received: 19/06/2025
rushed email to TEC sent with form TE7/TE9: 19/06/2025
Enforcement Notice letter left at reception desk: 23/06/2025
new email to TEC sent with correct sworn forms PE7/PE9:
23/06/2025
Hope this helps. Please let me know if more details about the
timeline are required. Thanks again for any help.
#Post#: 78031--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: June 24, 2025, 4:08 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
As you have submitted the correct forms (presumably emailed and
you have an auto response from TEC) then the matter is in their
hands. You also have had an enforcement visit.
While TEC deliberate I suggest you post your reasons for
submitting late(as per your submission) and read this synopsis:
HTML https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/bailiffs/
You might consider paying the enforcement officer because this
has NO effect on the outcome of TEC's consideration but would
prevent your goods being seized. If your OOT is successful then
ALL monies would be refunded.
#Post#: 78049--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: MrNeo
Date: June 24, 2025, 5:02 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> As you have submitted the correct forms (presumably emailed
and you have an auto response from TEC) then the matter is in
their hands. You also have had an enforcement visit.
>
> While TEC deliberate I suggest you post your reasons for
submitting late(as per your submission) and read this synopsis:
HTML https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/bailiffs/
>
> You might consider paying the enforcement officer because this
has NO effect on the outcome of TEC's consideration but would
prevent your goods being seized. If your OOT is successful then
ALL monies would be refunded.
>
--- End Quote ---
Thanks for your reply and share the link. Much appreciate your
help mate.
It seems they already applied the maximum charge, £515 and only
if they get goods they charge 110, right?
not too worried about the officer taking goods tho. nothing left
to sell, just few clothes and broken shoes ;)
The email submitted had ~14 files in total in attachment (mainly
proof of change address and due diligence).
From your reply the respondent should just wait for a reply from
TEC, right?
#Post#: 78071--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: June 25, 2025, 4:03 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Post the authority's response to your application when it's
received*, otherwise wait.
The problem with your que sera, sera approach to the prospect of
goods being seized is that if you share a property then others
could be inconvenienced. But this is a matter of personal choice
for you.
*- do the authority have your correct address? They should use
the one you inserted in the OOT (you did put your current
address?), but you never know.
TEC notify the authority of your submission and ask for their
view - this is what would be sent to you.
#Post#: 78155--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: MrNeo
Date: June 25, 2025, 11:27 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> Post the authority's response to your application when it's
received*, otherwise wait.
>
> The problem with your que sera, sera approach to the prospect
of goods being seized is that if you share a property then
others could be inconvenienced. But this is a matter of personal
choice for you.
>
> *- do the authority have your correct address? They should use
the one you inserted in the OOT (you did put your current
address?), but you never know.
>
> TEC notify the authority of your submission and ask for their
view - this is what would be sent to you.
>
--- End Quote ---
Like your QUE SERA, SERA :)
Where the respondent lives isn't the case.
I guess this is matter of fairness for the respondent who thinks
to succeed with the PE2/PE3 or when submitting the N244. A
previous application to TEC was successful and the original PCN
was issued/back to original.
#Post#: 78164--------------------------------------------------
Re: Out of Time Application (PE2/PE3) after Bailiff Action -
ENFORCEMENT STAGE
DIR By: MrNeo
Date: June 25, 2025, 11:55 am
---------------------------------------------------------
the council website (Pay PCN section) now shows: "There is a
problem.
The notice number you have entered to currently on stop. Please
contact London Borough of Newham."
what does it means?
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