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       #Post#: 81766--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: stamfordman
       Date: July 20, 2025, 6:43 am
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       Don't know why the section is headed 'applying discretion'.
       If you are sure no PCN was served on the van take them to the
       tribunal and opt for a telephone hearing.
       Adjudicators take a dim view of authorities telling porkies.
  HTML https://i.imgur.com/UrZAaWx.png
       #Post#: 81767--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: H C Andersen
       Date: July 20, 2025, 6:51 am
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       More procedural improprieties in the NOR than you can shake a
       stick at. IMO, they're doomed just by these.
       Register appeal:
       Procedural impropriety;
       Then come back here.
       We can expand on the PIs when it's registered.
       #Post#: 81769--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: DontStandForNonsense
       Date: July 20, 2025, 7:41 am
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       Great,
       So when registering the appeal with the tribunal website, I
       won't be asked for anything beyond the details of the NTO?
       #Post#: 81770--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: DontStandForNonsense
       Date: July 20, 2025, 7:42 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: stamfordman link ---
       >
       > Don't know why the section is headed 'applying discretion'.
       >
       > If you are sure no PCN was served on the van take them to the
       tribunal and opt for a telephone hearing.
       >
       > Adjudicators take a dim view of authorities telling porkies.
       >
       >
  HTML https://i.imgur.com/UrZAaWx.png
       >
       --- End Quote ---
       I hope so because that really is BS.
       Why could the not have come clean and said whatever the warden
       said, and where nothing was written, to say, we do not have a
       picture and can't say why one wasn't taken.
       #Post#: 81772--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: stamfordman
       Date: July 20, 2025, 7:50 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       They should indeed have come clean and admitted they served the
       wrong document - a postal PCN looks like it would have been
       correct. But they sent an NTO instead.
       We see a wrongly served NTO quite often and it can come down to
       your word against theirs, which is why speaking to the
       adjudicator is vital should they contest.
       I suspect in this case they've not bothered to check the CEO's
       notes and when they do won't contest the appeal.
       #Post#: 81781--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: DontStandForNonsense
       Date: July 20, 2025, 8:23 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: stamfordman link ---
       >
       > They should indeed have come clean and admitted they served
       the wrong document - a postal PCN looks like it would have been
       correct. But they sent an NTO instead.
       >
       > We see a wrongly served NTO quite often and it can come down
       to your word against theirs, which is why speaking to the
       adjudicator is vital should they contest.
       >
       > I suspect in this case they've not bothered to check the CEO's
       notes and when they do won't contest the appeal.
       >
       --- End Quote ---
       Yes that makes sense. Thanks for this.
       By the way, the tribunal website doesn't have the Procedural
       Impropriety option. Closest most relevant option seems to be:
       The authority made a procedural error.
       #Post#: 81783--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: DontStandForNonsense
       Date: July 20, 2025, 8:28 am
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       Also they have a further 2 parts (copied below).
       WOuld you advise me to leave them blank or add my version of
       events? i.e. Returned to the vehicle, saw the warden standing
       close by but since no PCN had been attached to my vehicle I
       drove away. Sometime later, I received a NTO in the post which I
       appealed on the basis that no PCN had been issued prior to the
       NTO. The Parking authority rejected by appeal but offered no
       evidence for serving the PCN.
       1. Explain your appeal
       Be as specific as you can, please include dates, times and
       locations where possible (3000 word limit). If you wish to add a
       longer explanation you may do so by uploading it as evidence
       (see below).
       2. Add your evidence
       Adding evidence to your appeal can be helpful to support your
       case, although you are not required to do so.
       Evidence that may be helpful could include:
       pay-and-display tickets
       photographs
       correspondence
       letters / statements from witnesses
       proof of vehicle ownership (such as DVLA records or sales
       receipts)
       invoices or delivery notes (to show loading while using your
       vehicle)
       permits or vouchers
       a copy of a Blue Badge
       Neither form of evidence is necessarily better than the other.
       Given the nature of the Tribunal process, please be aware that
       any evidence uploaded by either party (i.e. you or the
       Authority) can be seen by the other.
       So, if you decide to upload evidence of a personal nature,
       please ensure you remove or hide any information you do not wish
       to be seen by the Authority.
       If uploading a bank account statement, for example, this could
       mean removing or hiding your sort code / account number; or for
       medical records, this could mean removing your National
       Insurance Number.
       If you do not have evidence to hand right now, you are able to
       upload it to your case file at a later date.
       #Post#: 81790--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: H C Andersen
       Date: July 20, 2025, 11:09 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Even tribunals use different words, so for reference and
       accuracy here's what's in the Regulations:
  HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukdsi/2022/9780348232752/part/2/chapter/2
       (5) If the adjudicator concludes that a ground specified in
       regulation 5(4) applies, the adjudicator—
       (a)must allow the appeal, and
       (b)may give such directions to the enforcement authority as the
       adjudicator considers appropriate for the purpose of giving
       effect to that decision.
       5(4)
       (f)there has been a procedural impropriety on the part of the
       enforcement authority;
       #Post#: 81793--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: DontStandForNonsense
       Date: July 20, 2025, 11:29 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Should I explain my appeal or save it until the phone tribunal>
       #Post#: 81801--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Notice To Owner without having Received a PCN first
   DIR By: DontStandForNonsense
       Date: July 20, 2025, 2:10 pm
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       Ok I have submitted the appeal to the tribunal and explained my
       argument
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