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#Post#: 82480--------------------------------------------------
Re: contravention 31J - yellow box - car stalled
DIR By: MrChips
Date: July 24, 2025, 6:21 am
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The OP should put much more weight on MrMustard's opinion than
my own given his extensive tribunal experience.
But in my opinion there are two stationary vehicles involved in
the circumstances of the stop.
1) The motorcycle - this is directly responsible for the stop
but enters the box junction after (or just as) the OP enters the
box. On that basis it would be unreasonable to penalise the OP
for this as it should not have entered and the OP shouldn't be
expected to predict that it would.
2) The red car which turns out of the side road - due to the
actions of the motorcycle, we do not have the luxury of knowing
how the OP would have traversed the box and therefore whether
the OP would have had to stop due to this stationary vehicle.
All we can do it establish distance between the OP and the
vehicle and the speed of travel to deduce on balance of
probabilities if the OP would have "had to stop". As stated
earlier, the box length is 10.2 metres (as per googlemaps
distance measurer). The time between entry to the box and the
red car moving off is 8 seconds (to the nearest second).
Travelling across the box at leisurely walking speed (2.5 miles
per hour) would mean the red car had moved off by the time the
OP reached the other side. That speed doesn't seem inconsistent
with the speed upon entry and across the first portion of the
box prior to stopping. On that basis the OP did not cause their
vehicle to enter such that they (would have) had to stop due to
the presence of the red vehicle.
Or am I being too logical?
The letter is dated 11 July but it gives you 14 days from date
of service (assumed to be 15 July - 2 business days after
posting). Most PCN related deadlines include the day of
posting/service as part of the time period so to be safe treat
the deadline as 28 July rather than 29 July).
#Post#: 82483--------------------------------------------------
Re: contravention 31J - yellow box - car stalled
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: July 24, 2025, 6:47 am
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--- Quote from: MELBE link ---
>
> The letter is dated 11/07 that makes tomorrow the last day to
pay. I thought I would have chance to win. Do you think other
gurus will come with different ideas to go tribunal, e.g. camera
last proof check for accuracy or the person who check the
recordings or other ideas that maybe still a chance. £80 is
really heavy.
>
--- End Quote ---
Any of the above would involve an appeal at London Tribunals,
with the full £160 in play.
#Post#: 82801--------------------------------------------------
Re: contravention 31J - yellow box - car stalled
DIR By: MELBE
Date: July 26, 2025, 6:58 am
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maybe is to risky, I think I do not have many other options as
to pay £80, sadly
#Post#: 82803--------------------------------------------------
Re: contravention 31J - yellow box - car stalled
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: July 26, 2025, 7:23 am
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The NOR fails to inform you correctly of:
Your statutory rights of appeal;
The adjudicator's power to register an appeal made late i.e.
after the statutory period;
The council's power to serve a Charge Certificate.
Unfortunately, procedural impropriety is not grounds of appeal.
For the more experienced posters: would the cumulative effect of
the above justify the risk of appealing on the grounds of
'penalty exceeded....circumstances of the case' with the
circumstances effectively bringing a collateral challenge?
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