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#Post#: 92894--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: October 5, 2025, 7:46 am
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Paras. 11 and 12 apply in your case:
HTML https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Practice%20Direction%2002-2025%20on%20behalf%20of%20ETA%2019%20August%202025%20-%20Service%20of%20evidence%20by%20Enforcement%20Authorities.pdf
#Post#: 96334--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: markie76
Date: October 31, 2025, 10:06 am
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--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> Paras. 11 and 12 apply in your case:
>
>
HTML https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Practice%20Direction%2002-2025%20on%20behalf%20of%20ETA%2019%20August%202025%20-%20Service%20of%20evidence%20by%20Enforcement%20Authorities.pdf
>
--- End Quote ---
[member=24]Hippocrates[/member] - I've received the 'evidence
pack' by email today which consists of;
1. Video.
2. PDF of various docs inc; appeal confirmation, TMO, Challenge,
letters, stills, site pictures (some old ones highlighting the
turn left blue arrow?), picture showing the turn left arrow
(except buses & cycles) with the timed restriction sign in the
background past the road junction.
What should I do with it?
Appeal date: Tuesday 11th Nov 2025 Time: 10:00 Type: Personal -
video
Thank you.
#Post#: 96342--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: October 31, 2025, 11:17 am
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To add my six penneth, can I suggest you start with a simple and
clear description of the signage. Not what you were doing or
other vehicles or whatever but simple scene setting.
The location is situated in Tottenham Court Road approx. **
metres to the north/south/east/west (whichever) of the junction
of Tottenham Court Road with ****.
The sign changes the prevailing situation on TCR, namely **-way
traffic without moving traffic restrictions into a bus and
**-only carriageway.
This is effected on the ground by a single traffic sign situated
behind and clustered among other traffic signs and
infrastructure.
There are no advance warning signs or any other indication of
this dramatic change. Put simply, if a motorist could see the
sign from a reasonable enough distance away, then there's a
chance that they could discern its meaning and act accordingly.
But when there is poor intervisibility such as travelling behind
a high-sided vehicle on TCR or when they turn left then a
motorist's view is diminished or even non-existent until they
are virtually at the sign.
In my case............
By the way, what's the speed limit in that section of TCR?
#Post#: 96441--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: November 1, 2025, 10:42 am
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Appeal lost.
OP did not appear but the authority were represented.
The adjudicator's findings were that one sign is the regulatory
requirement(where this bold statement comes from I've no idea,
as we know the minimum legal test is 'adequacy') and that
'Signage was I found, on the council's cctv footage of the
incident, which I viewed, visible, and, I inferred, fully within
the appellant's line of vision
(my emphasis).
Whether there's a case for review on the grounds that the
adjudicator took into account something which they should not,
perhaps we can discuss. I refer to this in the decision: 'I
noted that prior to meeting the restriction, the appellant also
failed to comply with a mandatory direction to turn left at the
preceding junction.'
Also, OP what were the circumstances surrounding you not
appearing?
#Post#: 96444--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: November 1, 2025, 10:58 am
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It was vital to attend this. My only personal hearing was with
the same adjudicator and he was dismissive of unsighted signage
in a case where my wife was driving and we failed to convince
him despite good evidence.
This one backed up by the case I cited should have been won but
I doubt it can be reviewed.
The critical factor of where the CCTV is seems to lost on Mr
Harman.
The attendance by Camden is noteworthy.
------------
Case reference
Appellant
Authority
VRM
PCN Details
PCN
Contravention date
Contravention time
Contravention location
Street
Penalty amount
Contravention
Referral date
Decision Date
Adjudicator
Appeal decision
Direction
within 28 days.
Reasons
Mrs Cummins, for the council, attended the hearing of this
appeal today on the Microsoft Teams video conferencing platform.
The appellant did not attend the hearing.
I decided the appeal in his absence.
The contravention alleged in these proceedings was that this
vehicle, at Tottenham Court Road, used a route restricted to
certain vehicles.
I acknowledged the submissions made by the appellant around the
issue of signage.
The council is required to sign this restriction with one
regulatory sign only.
Signage was I found, on the council's cctv footage of the
incident, which I viewed, visible, and, I inferred, fully within
the appellant's line of vision. I was satisfied that it was
clear and correct. I noted that prior to meeting the
restriction, the appellant also failed to comply with a
mandatory direction to turn left at the preceding junction.
I was satisfied against this background that this contravention
had occurred.
The appeal was refused.
#Post#: 96484--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: markie76
Date: November 1, 2025, 7:56 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> Appeal lost.
>
> OP did not appear but the authority were represented.
>
> The adjudicator's findings were that one sign is the
regulatory requirement(where this bold statement comes from I've
no idea, as we know the minimum legal test is 'adequacy') and
that 'Signage was I found, on the council's cctv footage of the
incident, which I viewed, visible, and, I inferred, fully within
the appellant's line of vision
>
> (my emphasis).
>
> Whether there's a case for review on the grounds that the
adjudicator took into account something which they should not,
perhaps we can discuss. I refer to this in the decision: 'I
noted that prior to meeting the restriction, the appellant also
failed to comply with a mandatory direction to turn left at the
preceding junction.'
>
> Also, OP what were the circumstances surrounding you not
appearing?
>
--- End Quote ---
I think you have posted on the incorrect thread..?
#Post#: 96488--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: November 2, 2025, 2:05 am
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Thanks, you're right.
Can't delete at present.
#Post#: 96497--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: November 2, 2025, 4:51 am
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OK so wrong case but for reference here is the video and we know
Camden is taking an interest as authorities don't attend many
adjudications.
HTML https://i.ibb.co/JWyBNDgs/London-Boroughof-Camden-PCNEvidence-ezgif-com-video-to-gif-converter.gif
#Post#: 96502--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: November 2, 2025, 5:17 am
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I don't do Tuesdays. So, this will have to be adjourned to a
Wednesday, Friday or Saturday. PM received. We had better
communicate by phone to sort out a date, which will most
probably be March now. PM sent.
#Post#: 96644--------------------------------------------------
Re: Camden - Using a route restricted to certain vehicles; local
buses & cycles only - URGENT
DIR By: dwanyedibley
Date: November 3, 2025, 10:44 am
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Hello all,
I received a PCN for the exact same thing. That sign is
ridicolously small and should be 3 times bigger imo.
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/camden-borough-bus-lane-as-whole-road/
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