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#Post#: 78102--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: TF
Date: June 25, 2025, 6:22 am
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@cp8759 I have written a letter regarding the above , I have
attached this , I have not posted it as yet but does this sound
OK? Thank you
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 78105--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: June 25, 2025, 6:59 am
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I would just send this - do it online using the method specified
in the note to owner.
Dear Liverpool,
the contravention did not occur as the bay I was parked in had
no parking sign.
I did point out in my initial challenge that there was no sign
requiring paying to park in this bay, and indeed there was no
sign at all.
Please note that the picture of a sign taken by your CEO is
located in a different bay in this controlled parking zone and
not the one I parked in.
I trust this time you will cancel the PCN.
#Post#: 78110--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: TF
Date: June 25, 2025, 7:07 am
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Ok, keeping it simple .
Ok, thank you for the help I will do this. :)
#Post#: 78120--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: TF
Date: June 25, 2025, 7:44 am
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I have now submitted it online so I will let you know what
happens thanks again for all the help
#Post#: 79549--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: TF
Date: July 4, 2025, 7:17 am
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[member=1]cp8759[/member]
Hi, I have received a reply from liverpool council regarding my
PCN parking charge, please see attached
They have rejected it.
Please advice further
Thank you
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 79568--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: July 4, 2025, 8:13 am
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So they claim there is a bay sign at the other end of the bay -
but the picture of a sign they provided is on the other side of
the road. It's not a long bay you were in and there does not
appear that there has ever been a sign in the bay.
They have reoffered the discount which probably means they are
trying it on - let's check all the info and if all in order I
think you should appeal to the tribunal.
HTML https://i.ibb.co/23Cd3RtN/Screenshot-2025-07-04-at-14-05-46.png
HTML https://i.ibb.co/jvx95xp3/20250704-130340.jpg
#Post#: 79580--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: TF
Date: July 4, 2025, 8:46 am
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Yes , that's how I have read it, I have looked on Google maps
and I think I see one right at the other end near the dead end
on the same side, but this would not be visible to drivers
turning onto the street as the bay I was in is at the other end
of the street where that sign is, and any other signs are on the
other side, nothing is on the bay I parked in
Thanks for your help
#Post#: 79589--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: July 4, 2025, 9:22 am
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I'm not surprised.
Register your appeal. Contravention did not occur; Procedural
impropriety.
Once you've registered your appeal you can submit a more
comprehensive argument.
...along the lines of:
On *** I parked in the parking place.
(pl, pl stop referring to it as a bay). The law as regards
traffic signs refers to orders and these refer to designated
parking places - 'A local authority may by order designate
parking places on highways..'
As can be seen in the enclosed GSV snapshot and confirmed in the
authority's photos, this parking place is situated on the south
side of Falkner Street and extends for approx. 27 metres from
the termination of a 'Keep Clear' prohibition outside Abercromby
Nursery School to its junction with Bedford Street South. Within
this relatively short distance there are no street lamp columns
and no other traffic sign posts - or trees for that matter. It
is therefore perhaps not surprising that the council haven't
placed any 'traffic signs' (s64 RTRA refers) in or within the
vicinity of the parking place. There is another parking place on
the south side of Falkner Street but this is distinguished from
my location by virtue of being separated by the 'Keep Clear'
prohibition and a length of unrestricted street.
It therefore follows that, for the want of any traffic sign
conveying a restriction at my location, a motorist would not
know what restrictions might apply. In the circumstances of my
case, and by implication every other PCN issued in that place,
the CEO has been directed to photograph the nearest traffic sign
on the opposite side of the road (as can be seen in the
council's evidence where leafy trees are in evidence as they
frame the traffic sign relied upon).
I was not bound by this sign, indeed I didn't register it at the
time as I was focused on what restrictions applied to where I
parked, not places on the other side of the road.
The authority have rejected 2 sets of representations on the
fraudulent basis that the CEO's evidential photos establish the
council's compliance with LATOR and therefore their right to
pursue a penalty when those representations gave the clearest
evidence to the contrary. Indeed, in the NOR they have
compounded their lack of candour with the following statement:
'There are two signs on that road which state that it is permit
parking only. A sign is not required at that[presumably my]
location as there is already a sign at the other end of the road
in the bay'.
Setting aside for one moment that 'that' sign is not in my
parking place and that, as I now know because the NOR drew it to
my attention and I have measured, it is 210 feet from where my
car was parked, this is not even the sign presented in the
authority's evidence.
Given the authority's attempts to justify their error and
penalise me by relying upon spurious photographic evidence and
specious claims, it must surely follow that whether by virtue of
the regulations or their public law duty to act fairly these
actions give rise to grounds of 'procedural impropriety'. I
have therefore added 'Procedural Impropriety' to my statutory
grounds by virtue of this comment in the authority's NOR:
I am confident that now that this evidence and the council's
actions have been opened to more enlightened and impartial
scrutiny the adjudicator will see the truth of the matter and
cancel the PCN.
My thoughts.
#Post#: 79590--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 4, 2025, 9:29 am
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[member=5697]TF[/member] I've sent you a PM
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/index.php?action=pm.
#Post#: 84162--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN notice to owner from liverpool council
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: August 5, 2025, 4:27 am
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DNC'ed.
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