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#Post#: 6642--------------------------------------------------
01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not Accepted
DIR By: Londoner
Date: October 3, 2023, 11:41 am
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Hi all,
Back in September I Parked on DYL to deliver to a nearby shop. I
Was parked there for approx. 3 minutes and received a PCN. I
told the CEO (who hadn't even placed the ticket on my windscreen
yet) that I had just carried out a delivery but he was
uninterested.
I challenged the PCN and provided the signed delivery note but
it was rejected.
Note:
-The PCN has no observation time.
-Barnet are saying the evidence (i.e. delivery note) is
insufficient advising what criteria is necessary for a "valid"
delivery note, of which the only ones missing were "time" and
"amounts charged" - is this true or are they trying their luck?
-Their "rejection" letter gives conflicting/confusing
information. It first says I have 14 days to reply to their
letter, but after that says my challenge has been rejected and I
have 14 days to pay reduced amount or wait for the NtO.
How do I go about this? Any help will be greatly appreciated!
HTML https://i.ibb.co/YBm3QfK/PXL-20231003-122949120-2.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/yFtXPgM
HTML https://i.ibb.co/JmM2R6V/PXL-20231003-123529537-2.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/2WfP7Vx
HTML https://i.ibb.co/zXJJTH9/PXL-20231003-123555634.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/y6SScBv
#Post#: 6671--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: October 4, 2023, 4:04 am
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They seem to be asking for an invoice rather then a delivery
note and inferring all deliveries are commercial with loads of
data available....hey ho.
I am a firm believer that if a council asks for added proof,
what they are saying is that we are minded to cancel but want
something that we can file and that ticks our boxes.
Ignore the fine detail they ask for such as time, the important
bit is what can you supply.
So what can you supply from their list?
#Post#: 6677--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: October 4, 2023, 6:42 am
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I challenged the PCN and provided the signed delivery note but
it was rejected
As per DD, no it was not rejected, they asked for further info
and gave you what you should consider to be an indicative list
of items.
Clearly what you had sent them was insufficient to make a
favourable determination, but we don't know what you sent
because we haven't seen it.
You need to demonstrate that it was necessary to park the
vehicle where you did for the purpose of making a delivery.
Important considerations are the capacity in which you were
operating e.g. GIG, for an employer or whatever etc, and whether
what was being delivered required this vehicle to be used and
parked where it was.
They've given you until 6 Oct to get back to them, let's not
waste what remains by bemoaning why what you sent initially
wasn't accepted, let's discover more facts.
#Post#: 6685--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: Londoner
Date: October 4, 2023, 8:16 am
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--- Quote from: DancingDad link ---
>
> They seem to be asking for an invoice rather then a delivery
note and inferring all deliveries are commercial with loads of
data available....hey ho.
>
> I am a firm believer that if a council asks for added proof,
what they are saying is that we are minded to cancel but want
something that we can file and that ticks our boxes.
> Ignore the fine detail they ask for such as time, the
important bit is what can you supply.
> So what can you supply from their list?
>
--- End Quote ---
I actually did supply them with a "commercial" delivery note
with lots of information on it, which is why I thought Barnet
are just trying to be difficult in the hopes I'll pay up. (I was
delivering in my car for my employer)
As I said, the only details that were missing from the company
delivery note were the exact time of delivery and the amounts
charged, which are generally not included on a delivery note.
I can certainly supply them with the invoice but am not
convinced it'll be good enough, considering the delivery note
wasn't.
HTML https://i.ibb.co/BzCvzCL/PXL-20230915-114543031-2.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/2nkRnkq
#Post#: 6716--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: October 4, 2023, 3:08 pm
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I can see why you feel they are trying it on, can't remember the
last time, if ever I put time of delivery on a delivery note....
though to be fair, these days I am the recipient and the likes
of Amazon and Yodel time stamp via the driver's phone app.
Just moving forward before we suggest what to do....
Commercial delivery to commercial premises?
Not sure the size matters if the above is true but how big/heavy
was the package?
Have you the text of your initial challenge?
#Post#: 6717--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: Londoner
Date: October 4, 2023, 3:26 pm
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--- Quote from: DancingDad link ---
>
> I can see why you feel they are trying it on, can't remember
the last time, if ever I put time of delivery on a delivery
note.... though to be fair, these days I am the recipient and
the likes of Amazon and Yodel time stamp via the driver's phone
app.
>
> Just moving forward before we suggest what to do....
> Commercial delivery to commercial premises?
> Not sure the size matters if the above is true but how
big/heavy was the package?
> Have you the text of your initial challenge?
>
--- End Quote ---
Yes. Commercial delivery to commercial premises. It was a bulky
box of approx.10kg
Original challenge:
--- Quote ---
>
>
> I am challenging this PCN on the grounds that no contravention
occurred. I had parked as close as possible to the shop I was
delivering to - for approximately 3 minutes. Note, there was no
observation time. Unloading would have been witnessed had there
been a reasonable observation time. Attached is the delivery
note for the order being delivered. I look forward to the
cancellation of this wrongly issued PCN.
>
--- End Quote ---
#Post#: 6719--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: October 4, 2023, 4:37 pm
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Them just grouchy cos you told them that the PCN was wrongly
issued and the CEO should have observed.
For the record, PCN was not wrongly issued, just the CEO was a
bit quick off the mark and didn't seem to allow time to check
for exemptions.
General rule of thumb, don't criticise or complain....... as
with any rule, there are exceptions.
Dear Sirs
Ref PCN??
As per your letter dated ?? please find attached Delivery Note,
Commercial Invoice and a note from my company (on headed paper)
confirming that I was making commercial deliveries at the time
the PCN was issued.
Please note that the package contained ? 54" x 90" clear plastic
table clothes, was approximately WxDxH cm in size and weighed
10kg.
Many Thanks for accepting the loading exemption, I look forward
to your acknowledgement and cancellation of this PCN.
Hugs and Kisses.
Try that, if you cannot get a note from your company, it would
be a poor show... I used to type my own and get my boss to
sign..... signature is always "on behalf of company name"
I'd be very surprised if they do not accept but if they do, come
back to us, I cannot see any way you will lose this but you may
have to go all through the system.
#Post#: 6723--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: Londoner
Date: October 4, 2023, 4:56 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: DancingDad link ---
>
> Them just grouchy cos you told them that the PCN was wrongly
issued and the CEO should have observed.
> For the record, PCN was not wrongly issued, just the CEO was a
bit quick off the mark and didn't seem to allow time to check
for exemptions.
> General rule of thumb, don't criticise or complain....... as
with any rule, there are exceptions.
>
> Dear Sirs
> Ref PCN??
> As per your letter dated ?? please find attached Delivery
Note, Commercial Invoice and a note from my company (on headed
paper) confirming that I was making commercial deliveries at the
time the PCN was issued.
> Please note that the package contained ? 54" x 90" clear
plastic table clothes, was approximately WxDxH cm in size and
weighed 10kg.
> Many Thanks for accepting the loading exemption, I look
forward to your acknowledgement and cancellation of this PCN.
> Hugs and Kisses.
>
> Try that, if you cannot get a note from your company, it would
be a poor show... I used to type my own and get my boss to
sign..... signature is always "on behalf of company name"
>
> I'd be very surprised if they do not accept but if they do,
come back to us, I cannot see any way you will lose this but you
may have to go all through the system.
>
--- End Quote ---
Thanks for your help. Will try that and see what they come back
with.
Will update thread accordingly.
#Post#: 8470--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: Londoner
Date: October 26, 2023, 10:27 am
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Received Cancellation notice yesterday.
Thanks all for your advice!
#Post#: 8487--------------------------------------------------
Re: 01 Barnet PCN challenge rejected - Delivery Note Not
Accepted
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: October 26, 2023, 2:25 pm
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That will do nicely
Well done.
For the record, did you go with my suggestion?
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