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#Post#: 67510--------------------------------------------------
Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: anonymous
Date: April 17, 2025, 5:10 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hello all,
I had to rush to the hospital as my nephew was assaulted quite
badly and was taken to Emergency. Queens hospital offers parking
for blue badges, but all the bays were taken, and many people
were circling the car park. The driver ended up parking on
double yellows - which everyone else was also doing. I have done
so previously with no issue as everytime I go people have parked
on double yellows with a blue badge with no problem, but this
time it was in a slightly different location further down the
road. I assumed it would be alright as there was another vehicle
parked there also and no extra/contradicting parking signs that
I could see so I told the driver it was fine.
About 20 minutes later, we were issued a Parking Charge Notice
for unauthorised parking, along with the car next to me. However
just up the road, none of the other vehicles parked on double
yellows were issued a PCN. I do not see any signs that say you
can park on these double yellows, or you cannot park on these
double yellows etc
Is there anything we can do to fight this charge?
PCN:
HTML https://i.ibb.co/8gymvnc0/PCN-Front.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/8gymvnc0
HTML https://i.ibb.co/JjKnCyH7/PCN-Back.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/JjKnCyH7
Google Street view link:
Click here for GSV
HTML https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5680182,0.1823835,3a,75y,268.54h,67.47t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s9Re7wbWn--aS6YwnXd0Nng!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D22.530677925219493%26panoid%3D9Re7wbWn--aS6YwnXd0Nng%26yaw%3D268.5363434568236!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDQxNC4wIKXMDSoJLDEwMjExNDU1SAFQAw%3D%3D
Location of vehicle parked: (Red X marks the spot)
HTML https://i.ibb.co/jvtWSZGZ/Screenshot-2025-04-16-172302.png
HTML https://ibb.co/jvtWSZGZ
HTML https://i.ibb.co/PGvbYCS4/Car-Location.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/PGvbYCS4
HTML https://i.ibb.co/B5qDZ86z/BMW-Front.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/B5qDZ86z
HTML https://i.ibb.co/tPZSQG7f/BMW-Back.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/tPZSQG7f
HTML https://i.ibb.co/6c9dhv9L/BMW-Ticket.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/6c9dhv9L
Other cars parked on double yellows with blue badges and no
tickets. Some of whom were there way before me:
HTML https://i.ibb.co/rGr8fHZZ/PXL-20250416-154124295.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/rGr8fHZZ
HTML https://i.ibb.co/XxgJLR63/PXL-20250416-154947089.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/XxgJLR63
HTML https://i.ibb.co/rG9Z3mxy/PXL-20250416-154950374.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/rG9Z3mxy
The signages I could find dotted around:
HTML https://i.ibb.co/Fp6RcPC/Sign-1.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/Fp6RcPC
HTML https://i.ibb.co/5X93s8XV/Sign-2.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/5X93s8XV
#Post#: 67569--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: b789
Date: April 17, 2025, 11:34 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Please show the whole of the Notice to Driver (NtD) that was
received. You only need to redact the VRM, nothing else.
Have you complained to the hospital PALS service? They are your
first port of call and can get the Parking Charge Notice (PCN)
cancelled. I suggest you also copy in the Chief Executive of the
NHS Trust for that hospital.
DO not appeal anything until we've see the whole of the NtD and
certainly not before day 27 after the date the notice was issued
and definitely not later than day 28.
#Post#: 67605--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: anonymous
Date: April 17, 2025, 3:57 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: b789 link ---
>
> Please show the whole of the Notice to Driver (NtD) that was
received. You only need to redact the VRM, nothing else.
>
> Have you complained to the hospital PALS service? They are
your first port of call and can get the Parking Charge Notice
(PCN) cancelled. I suggest you also copy in the Chief Executive
of the NHS Trust for that hospital.
>
> DO not appeal anything until we've see the whole of the NtD
and certainly not before day 27 after the date the notice was
issued and definitely not later than day 28.
>
--- End Quote ---
We have not received a NtD. We got the PCN yesterday posted on
the car at the hospital. Am I meant to wait for a letter?
I have not spoken to the pals team but my experience of them in
the past at this hospital has not been a positive one.
#Post#: 67620--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: DWMB2
Date: April 18, 2025, 3:48 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote ---
> We have not received a NtD. We got the PCN yesterday posted on
the car at the hospital
--- End Quote ---
The notice on the windscreen is the Notice to Driver.
--- Quote ---
> I have not spoken to the pals team but my experience of them
in the past at this hospital has not been a positive one.
--- End Quote ---
Still worth contacting them in my opinion. They may be helpful,
they may not. If you don't contact them at all they definitely
won't be helpful.
#Post#: 67630--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: anonymous
Date: April 18, 2025, 6:45 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: DWMB2 link ---
>
> [quote]We have not received a NtD. We got the PCN yesterday
posted on the car at the hospital
--- End Quote ---
The notice on the windscreen is the Notice to Driver.
--- Quote ---
> I have not spoken to the pals team but my experience of them
in the past at this hospital has not been a positive one.
--- End Quote ---
Still worth contacting them in my opinion. They may be helpful,
they may not. If you don't contact them at all they definitely
won't be helpful.
[/quote]
I see. The NtD are the first 2 images in the first post. That
was what was received. I will try and also contact pals.
Anything specific I can say to them?
#Post#: 67654--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: b789
Date: April 18, 2025, 11:26 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: anonymous link ---
>
> The NtD are the first 2 images in the first post. That was
what was received.
>
--- End Quote ---
You've truncated the images. We need to see the whole NtD. You
only need redact your VRM and the PCN number.
When contacting PALS, remind them of their obligations as stated
in this document:
NHS car parking guidance 2022 for NHS trusts and NHS foundation
trusts
HTML https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles
Also, I suggest you write to the Trust Chief Executive and let
them delegate of their minions to handle your case.
#Post#: 67663--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: anonymous
Date: April 18, 2025, 2:03 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: b789 link ---
>
> [quote author=anonymous link=topic=5984.msg67630#msg67630
date=1744976731]
> The NtD are the first 2 images in the first post. That was
what was received.
>
--- End Quote ---
You've truncated the images. We need to see the whole NtD. You
only need redact your VRM and the PCN number.
When contacting PALS, remind them of their obligations as stated
in this document:
NHS car parking guidance 2022 for NHS trusts and NHS foundation
trusts
HTML https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles
Also, I suggest you write to the Trust Chief Executive and let
them delegate of their minions to handle your case.
[/quote]
If you click on them they should show the whole thing. No matter
I have attached them to this post[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 67705--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: b789
Date: April 19, 2025, 5:20 am
---------------------------------------------------------
OK. So the NtD is not compliant with PoFA 7(2)(a) because it
does not specify the period of parking to which the notice
relates. There is no evidence that the vehicle remained parked
for longer than the minimum consideration period for a contract
to have been formed.
For now, the Keeper complains to PALS and the NHS Trust CEO to
get them to have the PCN cancelled. If there has been no
confirmation of the PCN being canceled by Tuesday 14th May, you
submit the following appeal to Gemini, only as the Keeper:
--- Quote ---
> I am the keeper of the vehicle and I dispute your 'parking
charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I
will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your
client landowner.
>
> As your Notice to Driver (NtD) does not fully comply with ALL
the requirements of PoFA 2012, you are unable to hold the keeper
of the vehicle liable for the charge. Partial or even
substantial compliance is not sufficient. There will be no
admission as to who was driving and no inference or assumptions
can be drawn. Gemini has relied on contract law allegations of
breach against the driver only.
>
> The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have
been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation
of the law of agency. Your NtD can only hold the driver liable.
Gemini have no hope should you be so foolish as to eventually
try and litigate this, so you are urged to save us both a
complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.
--- End Quote ---
Make sure you put Tuesday 14th May in your diary with a reminder
to not miss that date. The reason is to try and get them to
reject the appeal without issuing a Notice to Keeper (NtK)
within the prescribed period.
This PCN would never stand up in a court should they be do
stupid as to try and make a claim later on.
#Post#: 67714--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: anonymous
Date: April 19, 2025, 6:01 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: b789 link ---
>
> OK. So the NtD is not compliant with PoFA 7(2)(a) because it
does not specify the period of parking to which the notice
relates. There is no evidence that the vehicle remained parked
for longer than the minimum consideration period for a contract
to have been formed.
>
> For now, the Keeper complains to PALS and the NHS Trust CEO to
get them to have the PCN cancelled. If there has been no
confirmation of the PCN being canceled by Tuesday 14th May, you
submit the following appeal to Gemini, only as the Keeper:
>
> [quote]I am the keeper of the vehicle and I dispute your
'parking charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement
and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to
your client landowner.
>
> As your Notice to Driver (NtD) does not fully comply with ALL
the requirements of PoFA 2012, you are unable to hold the keeper
of the vehicle liable for the charge. Partial or even
substantial compliance is not sufficient. There will be no
admission as to who was driving and no inference or assumptions
can be drawn. Gemini has relied on contract law allegations of
breach against the driver only.
>
> The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have
been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation
of the law of agency. Your NtD can only hold the driver liable.
Gemini have no hope should you be so foolish as to eventually
try and litigate this, so you are urged to save us both a
complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.
--- End Quote ---
Make sure you put Tuesday 14th May in your diary with a reminder
to not miss that date. The reason is to try and get them to
reject the appeal without issuing a Notice to Keeper (NtK)
within the prescribed period.
This PCN would never stand up in a court should they be do
stupid as to try and make a claim later on.
[/quote]
Thank you so much today. I will do as you say. Just for
clarification, do I submit the appeal on the 14th or before? I.e
the 13th? Also if it is the 14th should I do it before a certain
time? Lastly I assume I am to appeal using their online portal?
#Post#: 67722--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gemini Parking Solutions - Queens Hospital Romford - Double
yellows with blue badge
DIR By: b789
Date: April 19, 2025, 7:24 am
---------------------------------------------------------
You submit it on the 14th, any time before close of business.
Use their online portal but make sure you do not select any
option that requires you to admit to being the driver. You are
appealing solely as the Keeper.
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