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#Post#: 62807--------------------------------------------------
SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after Payment
Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: swim80
Date: March 17, 2025, 4:20 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi,
On the 9th March the driver of the vehicle (indicated in the NtK
notice here:
HTML https://imgur.com/a/OjsKHdw)
parked at the SIP Car
park, Spaniel Row , Nottingham.
Upon arrival the driver parked and then proceeded to pay at the
ticket machine located at the car park entrance. The driver
estimated the stay to be not longer than 2 hours and purchased a
ticket in accordance with this expected duration (see here for
prices:
HTML https://imgur.com/a/DfzQXky).
At the time of purchase,
the machine indicated that no ticket would be provided. The
driver used a contactless debit card to make payment and upon
completing the transaction, the on-screen display of the payment
device indicated that the payment had been approved.
Approximately one hour later the driver returned and left the
car park.
On the 16th March the registered keeper of the vehicle received
a parking charge notice related to the stay of the vehicle on
the aforementioned date. Upon subsequent consultation with the
driver it became apparent that, in spite of on-screen indication
to the contrary, the contactless payment met with a technical
error as evidenced by the driver's bank statement (see here:
HTML https://imgur.com/a/OYR1v4D)
and thus payment for the stay was
not taken.
Based upon the above evidence of technical payment error, the
keeper of the vehicle believes that the parking charge notice
was issued in error and would like to ask the advice of the
forum on how best to proceed to challenge this.
Best Regards,
The Registered Keeper
#Post#: 62812--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: swim80
Date: March 17, 2025, 4:52 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi all,
As an aside, the registered keeper asked Deepseek R1 to provide
a letter of appeal in line with the the private parking sector
single code of practice. This is included below for reference
and would be grateful for a review of the
appropriateness/correctness of this:
HTML https://imgur.com/a/twBsuPP
#Post#: 62922--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: b789
Date: March 17, 2025, 12:51 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
That letter says that you have a screenshot of the permit
machine screen showing the transaction as "Approved".It also
says you have a bank statement showing "no transaction" for the
date???
You have only shown us a photo of the payment machine tariffs.
Is the screenshot of the declined payment actually from a bank
statement? Where is the screenshot of the "approved" payment
from the payment machine?
You are referencing the BPA CoP which was superseded in October
last year by the BPA/IPC Private Parking Single Code of Practice
(PPSCoP).
Not sure exactly what you are expecting. The Notice to Keeper
(NtK) is PoFA compliant so they can transfer ability from the
unknown driver to you, the known keeper. However, PoFA
compliance is not only with reference to the NtK. The signs at
the location must adequately bring to the attention of the
motorist the charge for breaching the terms and conditions. You
can also use the Consumer Rights Act 2015 (CRA) for frustration
of contract.
#Post#: 62932--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: swim80
Date: March 17, 2025, 1:06 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi,
Thanks for your help and review of this.
I have a screenshot of the driver's bank statement only (see
here:
HTML https://imgur.com/a/S8Nbbxk
); indicating the technical
error. At the time of payment, the payment machine indicated
that the payment was approved and thus there was no reason to
capture a photo. Are you able to confirm that this is sufficient
evidence to challenge the PCN?
Many Thanks,
The Registered Keeper
#Post#: 62943--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: b789
Date: March 17, 2025, 1:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Any initial appeal to an unregulated private parking company
will be rejected, no matter what you plead. The secondary
appeals process will depend on which ATA the company belongs to.
If they are BPA members, then you would be able to appeal to
POPLA with a roughly 40:60 chance of success. If they are an IPC
member, ten you chances of success with the IAS are around 4:96.
Either way, if the secondary appeal is unsuccessful, that
decision is not binding on you and you can then ignore
everything except if they issue a claim for the alleged debt.
Even then, there is every likelihood that they will never let it
get as far as a hearing and if they did, your chances of success
are high. The most likely scenario is that if they let it get as
far as a claim, is that the claim is struck out or discontinued.
You have to decide whether you are prepared to fight this all
the way.
#Post#: 64010--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: swim80
Date: March 25, 2025, 3:04 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi,
Thanks for your support. I intend to fight this. I'd like to
kindly request you review the appeal letter I have prepared
(
HTML https://imgur.com/a/y2mhc0C)
before I populate the details and
submit my appeal. It is revised to ensure accuracy of available
evidence and to reference the latest PPSCoP (v1.1).
Kind Regards,
TRK
#Post#: 64075--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: b789
Date: March 25, 2025, 9:22 am
---------------------------------------------------------
As I already mentioned, any initial appeal, no matter how clear
you try to make it, is going to be rejected. So, with that in
mind, whatever you send is going to bee a wasted effort.
As SIP are IPC members, their offer of a secondary appeal to the
IAS will be about as useful as a poke in the arm with a sharp
stick. Personally, I wouldn't bother with an IAS appeal although
others on here will disagree. The choice is yours.
Where this will ultimately be settled is if it is referred to
the county court as a small claim. No one who is here receiving
advice and following it pays a penny to the likes of SIP. Any
claim, if they even try to take this that far, will either be
struck out or discontinued. Even if you were to be one of the
less than 1% that were ever to get as far as an actual hearing,
you'd be likely to win anyway.
It's up to you how you want to proceed. But thigh the above in
mind, you make your choice. The appeal you have shown is clear
and follows logic. It's a pity that SIP and the IAS don't.
#Post#: 64085--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: swim80
Date: March 25, 2025, 10:00 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi,
Thanks for your quick reply. I guess my aim here is to make a
clear and defensible appeal from the outset regardless of the
anticipated futility of the appeal process. Should the case find
it's way to court, I'd like to believe that evidence of
adherence to correct and due process throughout weighs in my
favour. Thanks again for taking the time to reply to mine and
all of the other cases on this forum. Your help is invaluable! I
shall keep the post updated with the state of progress of this
case.
Many Thanks,
TRK
#Post#: 67550--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: swim80
Date: April 17, 2025, 9:52 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi,
An update on the progress of this situation: The parking
operator SIP has sent a further demand for payment without any
acknowledgement of the written appeal. An appeal letter was sent
by recorded postal delivery within the allowable appeal time to
the specified appeal address. I'd like to ask for a
recommendation on a suitable next response. Should I send a
further letter highlighting that an appeal letter was sent in
the allotted time or simply ignore all further correspondence
from SIP?
Kind Regards,
TrK
#Post#: 67561--------------------------------------------------
Re: SIP, Nottingham, Spaniel Row: Parking Charge NtK after
Payment Machine 'Technical Error'
DIR By: b789
Date: April 17, 2025, 11:05 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Stop wasting money by sending letters by recorded delivery. An
absolutely useless service which, at best can only prove
non-delivery. ALL correspondence must be by email which is also
CC'd to yourself. It is instant and you also have proof of
delivery.
If you insist on using snail mail, the you only need to send it
by first class post with a free "Prof of Posting" certificate
from any post office.
You don't seem to have gathered the fact that you are not
dealing with some firm that has any customer service ethos. They
are a bunch of ex-clampers operating on the very edge of
lawfulness.
They re not going to accept any appeal you send (they haven't
and they've ignored it) and appealing to the IAS will be an
equally salutary experience if you want to even bother with
them. You can try and make a forma complaint to the IPC but
again, you will be fobbed off and considered a mug by them. But
hey, fill your boots if you insist.
I have already explained that the only way this will end in
success for you is after they make a claim.
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