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#Post#: 60583--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: andy_foster
Date: March 4, 2025, 1:15 pm
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3 points. Same as if you plead not guilty and are convicted -
although pleading guilty will reduce the fine and surcharge by
1/3 and the prosecution costs by about £530.
#Post#: 60712--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: settop23
Date: March 5, 2025, 8:23 am
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Thanks - at least that some consolation. If i decided to plead
not guilty and the matter went to court, would i be able to
request more video / photo evidence such as how long the arrows
were displayed for prior to the RED x, and how long I was
driving in the red X lane before i moved over? Can i request
this information before i make my plea?
#Post#: 60716--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: Southpaw82
Date: March 5, 2025, 8:35 am
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I’m not sure why any of that would be disclosed to you. The
offence is not “driving past a red x 10 seconds after it came
on”, so what is the relevance of how long it had been displayed
for?
#Post#: 60731--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: NewJudge
Date: March 5, 2025, 9:32 am
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Before you enter your plea you are only entitled to "The Initial
Details of the Prosecution Case". This is basically the evidence
the police intend to rely on to see you convicted.
If you want anything else and the police will not provide it,
you must ask the court to order its disclosure. The court will
want to know why you want it and you will have to show why you
believe it will either assist your defence or undermine the
prosecution's case.
You don't seem to dispute that you had at least the distance
between two gantries to move to the next lane so the time the
red Xs were displayed seems not to be an issue. You have already
been told that the one you passed had been displayed for 30
minutes. How far beyond them you went will do nothing to show
you are not guilty. It may provide mitigation but the offence is
committed as soon as you pass the gantry.
And all this assumes there is any other evidence. You mention
"video" evidence. Do you suppose that motorways are regularly
video'd 24/7?
#Post#: 60755--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: settop23
Date: March 5, 2025, 10:54 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I’m not actually sure if it was one or two gantries that
displayed the arrows, nor am I sure if they were in the first
lane, second lane or both lanes.
Surely there should be a record of how long and which lanes the
white arrows were displayed.
But if this isn’t recorded or logged then the judge would simply
find me
Guilty based on one photo of my car in the red X lane, with
traffic behind me and next to me. Despite me saying in court
that the arrows were not clearly displayed in both lanes and did
not give me enough time to safely move over before the red x was
displayed
I appreciate the advice and input from everybody, I will decide
in the next few days which way to plead
#Post#: 60761--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: mickR
Date: March 5, 2025, 11:11 am
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ask the highways agency for the logs.
#Post#: 60768--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: settop23
Date: March 5, 2025, 11:25 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi
I will email info@nationalhighways.co.uk (is that the correct
email if anybody has done it before)
And ask about the logs. Hopefully they will provide me with some
clarification on how long I had to move out of the lane before I
was flashed.
#Post#: 60781--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: NewJudge
Date: March 5, 2025, 12:00 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I don’t think you are approaching this correctly.
The arrows advising you to change lane are not mandatory. They
are advisory and are accompanied by yellow flashing lights.
There is no penalty for ignoring them.
The red “X” is accompanied by red flashing lights and is
mandatory. You must not proceed beyond it in the lane to which
it applies. It does not mean you may do so if you are unable to
move safely to an open lane. It is equivalent to red traffic
light and your only option, if you cannot change lanes, is to
stop.
I cannot see how knowing how long the preceding “arrow” signs
were illuminated will help you. The red X which you passed had
been displayed for 30 minutes and it would have been visible
from good distance as you approached it.
--- Quote ---
> But if this isn’t recorded or logged then the judge would
simply find me Guilty based on one photo of my car in the red X
lane,
--- End Quote ---
There’s every likelihood of that, with or without the
information about the arrows.
--- Quote ---
> Despite me saying in court that the arrows were not clearly
displayed in both lanes and did not give me enough time to
safely move over before the red x was displayed..
--- End Quote ---
Then in those circumstances you should have stopped. The court
will be aware of that. It’s explained here:
HTML https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/know-your-traffic-signs/motorway-signs-signals-and-road-markings#motorway-signals-and-variable-signs
“When red lights are flashing above your lane, you must stop
unless you can move safely to a lane where red signals are not
showing.”
#Post#: 60927--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: settop23
Date: March 6, 2025, 7:30 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Thanks - I understand however i still think there was not enough
of a gap for me to move over or stop safely, as there were
vehicles behind me. I did make effort to move over or stop, such
as reducing my speed but did not want to cause a collision.
Would you advise me to plead guilty via post and accept 3
points? I would like to avoid any penalty points, I already
have 3 penalty points on my license albeit they expire next
year. I have been a full time taxi driver for over 30 years
with no other driving offences or accidents in this time.
#Post#: 60939--------------------------------------------------
Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
X
DIR By: Anarchist
Date: March 6, 2025, 7:53 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote ---
> i still think there was not enough of a gap for me to move
over or stop safely
--- End Quote ---
The gantries are designed so that they are visible from a
minimum distance of 300m (roughly 10 seconds at 70mph).
If you know what your speed was (presumably much less than 70mph
as there were lane closures) you will be able to work out the
minimum time you would have been able to see the red X.
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