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       #Post#: 60583--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: andy_foster
       Date: March 4, 2025, 1:15 pm
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       3 points. Same as if you plead not guilty and are convicted -
       although pleading guilty will reduce the fine and surcharge by
       1/3 and the prosecution costs by about £530.
       #Post#: 60712--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: settop23
       Date: March 5, 2025, 8:23 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Thanks - at least that some consolation.  If i decided to plead
       not guilty and the matter went to court, would i be able to
       request more video / photo evidence such as how long the arrows
       were displayed for prior to the RED x, and how long I was
       driving in the red X lane before i moved over? Can i request
       this information before i make my plea?
       #Post#: 60716--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: Southpaw82
       Date: March 5, 2025, 8:35 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       I’m not sure why any of that would be disclosed to you. The
       offence is not “driving past a red x 10 seconds after it came
       on”, so what is the relevance of how long it had been displayed
       for?
       #Post#: 60731--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: NewJudge
       Date: March 5, 2025, 9:32 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Before you enter your plea you are only entitled to "The Initial
       Details of the Prosecution Case". This is basically the evidence
       the police intend to rely on to see you convicted.
       If you want anything else and the police will not provide it,
       you must ask the court to order its disclosure. The court will
       want to know why you want it and you will have to show why you
       believe it will either assist your defence or undermine the
       prosecution's case.
       You don't seem to dispute that you had at least the distance
       between two gantries to move to the next lane so the time the
       red Xs were displayed seems not to be an issue. You have already
       been told that the one you passed had been displayed for 30
       minutes. How far beyond them you went will do nothing to show
       you are not guilty. It may provide mitigation but the offence is
       committed as soon as you pass the gantry.
       And all this assumes there is any other evidence. You mention
       "video" evidence. Do you suppose that motorways are regularly
       video'd 24/7?
       #Post#: 60755--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: settop23
       Date: March 5, 2025, 10:54 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       I’m not actually sure if it was one or two gantries that
       displayed the arrows, nor am I sure if they were in the first
       lane, second lane or both lanes.
       Surely there should be a record of how long and which lanes the
       white arrows were displayed.
       But if this isn’t recorded or logged then the judge would simply
       find me
       Guilty based on one photo of my car in the red X lane, with
       traffic behind me and next to me. Despite me saying in court
       that the arrows were not clearly displayed in both lanes and did
       not give me enough time to safely move over before the red x was
       displayed
       I appreciate the advice and input from everybody, I will decide
       in the next few days which way to plead
       #Post#: 60761--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: mickR
       Date: March 5, 2025, 11:11 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       ask the highways agency for the logs.
       #Post#: 60768--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: settop23
       Date: March 5, 2025, 11:25 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Hi
       I will email info@nationalhighways.co.uk (is that the correct
       email if anybody has done it before)
       And ask about the logs. Hopefully they will provide me with some
       clarification on how long I had to move out of the lane before I
       was flashed.
       #Post#: 60781--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: NewJudge
       Date: March 5, 2025, 12:00 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       I don’t think you are approaching this correctly.
       The arrows advising you to change lane are not mandatory. They
       are advisory and are accompanied by yellow flashing lights.
       There is no penalty for ignoring them.
       The red “X” is accompanied by red flashing lights and is
       mandatory. You must not proceed beyond it in the lane to which
       it applies. It does not mean you may do so if you are unable to
       move safely to an open lane. It is equivalent to  red traffic
       light and your only option, if you cannot change lanes, is to
       stop.
       I cannot see how knowing how long the preceding “arrow” signs
       were illuminated will help you. The red X which you passed had
       been displayed for 30 minutes and it would have been visible
       from  good distance as you approached it.
       --- Quote ---
       > But if this isn’t recorded or logged then the judge would
       simply find me Guilty based on one photo of my car in the red X
       lane,
       --- End Quote ---
       There’s every likelihood of that, with or without the
       information about the arrows.
       --- Quote ---
       > Despite me saying in court that the arrows were not clearly
       displayed in both lanes and did not give me enough time to
       safely move over before the red x was displayed..
       --- End Quote ---
       Then in those circumstances you should have stopped. The court
       will be aware of that. It’s explained here:
  HTML https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/know-your-traffic-signs/motorway-signs-signals-and-road-markings#motorway-signals-and-variable-signs
       “When red lights are flashing above your lane, you must stop
       unless you can move safely to a lane where red signals are not
       showing.”
       #Post#: 60927--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: settop23
       Date: March 6, 2025, 7:30 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Thanks - I understand however i still think there was not enough
       of a gap for me to move over or stop safely, as there were
       vehicles behind me. I did make effort to move over or stop, such
       as reducing my speed but did not want to cause a collision.
       Would you advise me to plead guilty via post and accept 3
       points?  I would like to avoid any penalty points, I already
       have 3 penalty points on my license albeit they expire next
       year.  I have been a full time taxi driver for over 30 years
       with no other driving offences or accidents in this time.
       #Post#: 60939--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Single justice procedure issued for driving in lane with RED
       X
   DIR By: Anarchist
       Date: March 6, 2025, 7:53 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote ---
       > i still think there was not enough of a gap for me to move
       over or stop safely
       --- End Quote ---
       The gantries are designed so that they are visible from a
       minimum distance of 300m (roughly 10 seconds at 70mph).
       If you know what your speed was (presumably much less than 70mph
       as there were lane closures) you will be able to work out the
       minimum time you would have been able to see the red X.
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