DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
FreeTrafficLegalAdvice
HTML https://ftla.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so ...
*****************************************************
#Post#: 59902--------------------------------------------------
PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: Pensiva
Date: February 27, 2025, 12:20 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[img]
HTML https://drive.google.com/drive/u/0/home[/img]
Any advice about whether it is worth challenging this PCN I was
not aware I was in buslane impossible to see on dark rainy night
I was following the traffic in front of me.
Thanks
[attachimg=1]
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 59906--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: John U.K.
Date: February 27, 2025, 12:47 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
This is a well known spot for PCNs. Some appeals are successful,
some not. The signage and road-markings have changed over the
years, but you can try searching this forum (top r-h corner of
this page) with shepherds bush bus lane as the search term.
Here are a couple of threads
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/34j-being-in-a-bus-lane-camera-enforcement-shepherd-bush-rd-southbound-5233/msg59288/#msg59288
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/hammersmith-and-fulham-being-in-a-bus-lane-shepherds-bush-rd-southbound-offside-/msg20795/#msg20795
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/34j-being-in-a-bus-lane-camera-enforcement-shepherd-bush-rd-southbound-offside/msg50582/#msg50582
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/motorcycle-in-bus-lane-confusing-sign/msg34053/#msg34053
Meanwhile, please post up the rest of the PCN, the video (which
is the evidence), and a GSV link to the location.
Hopefully [member=24]Hippocrates[/member] (a learned member who
has had success here) will be able to help you with this one.
#Post#: 59928--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: scienceguy142
Date: February 27, 2025, 5:38 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Just throwing in my two pence, as I have also been done here
before (and fought it, and won).
I had to go all the way to the Tribunal Stage however,
Long story short; the signage the DfT approved doesn't match
what is there. This was the grounds of my success.
Various defences have been successfully put forward as well.
They've recently adjusted the signage (I drive past daily) with
advance warning notices, as well as a massive sign saying bus
lane on the right which you shouldn't miss, but, as it stands it
doesn't meat the approved layout per the DfT.
Good luck.
Oh, and in my rejection letters they were simply copy and pasted
from elsewhere. I asked questions in my appeal (such as what
does 2+2 equal) and they were not answered; verbatim responses
no less from PePPpioo's other victims.
#Post#: 59929--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: scienceguy142
Date: February 27, 2025, 5:39 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
This is the authorised plan, which they do not follow.
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 59954--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: February 28, 2025, 5:14 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Most recently I have won 2 out of 2 at this location. I also
have substantial correspondence with H and F over 10 years and
the DFT. They have now added extra "warning" signs which are
actually 959B signs. The actual reversed 958 sign they use to
indicate the bus lane start is actually a warning sign. I said
to Mr Greenslade in the second case below it reminded me of
Morecambe and Wise: playing the right notes but not necessarily
in the bright order. Eric to Andre.
2240326638.
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/hammersmith-and-fulham-being-in-a-bus-lane-shepherds-bush-rd-southbound-offside-/msg34058/#msg34058
And: 2240418124.
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/motorcycle-in-bus-lane-confusing-sign/msg43158/#msg43158
Plus this is useful: 2240105209
If you want my help, better to correspond via e mails. I am also
considering a big "discussion" with DFT over this for them to
explain why they have departed from Chapter Three TSM and ask
them to rescind the authorisation and/or change the signs.
**
Draft:
Dear Hammersmith and Fulham
Re PCN: HZ81783446
I challenge the PCN on the following grounds:
1. I am in possession of the special DFT authorisation for this
offside bus lane and it is clear that you have departed from the
agreed plan of the layout of the signage, in particular the 958
sign. The actual reversed 958 sign they use to indicate the bus
lane start is actually a warning sign.
2. Notwithstanding that there is the said authorisation, I
refer you to this extract from a High Court decision:
R(Oxfordshire County Council) v The Bus Lane Adjudicator
[2010]EWHC 894 (Admin) Mr Justice Beatson confirmed that,
Para 65. The Defendant's submission that the fact that signs
are prescribed or authorised does not mean they are sufficient
for securing adequate information as to the effect of an order
is made available to road users is clearly correct. If the signs
do not in fact provide adequate information no offence is
committed;
I argue, therefore, that your departure from the DFT authorised
plan by placing the 958 sign AFTER the taper line substantially
exacerbates your problem concerning enforcement.
3. All your signs wholly contradict the TSM Chapter Three in
terms of their very positions and actual meaning.
In light of the above, which clearly expresses this total
confusion of signage, I request that you cancel the PCN
forthwith.
Name
Registered keeper
Address
**
Be prepared for the long time and they do not reoffer the
discount if your reps. against the Enforcement Notice are not
successful.
#Post#: 59964--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: Pensiva
Date: February 28, 2025, 6:26 am
---------------------------------------------------------
OK thank you so worth a challenge using what you have sent as a
draft?
#Post#: 59995--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: February 28, 2025, 10:00 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes indeed. Not only did they not turn up in both the cases
(fatal) but also we won on their evidence in the first one too.
So, please sign my petition in my signature.
#Post#: 60042--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: Pensiva
Date: February 28, 2025, 12:42 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[img]
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/16xLxw4srkEM2neQe3Uw-ZDVdl0iGgKLA/view?usp=drive_link[/img]
#Post#: 60044--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Buslane Shepherds Bush Rd Southbound Offside
DIR By: Pensiva
Date: February 28, 2025, 12:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Done
*****************************************************
Page 1 of 1