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#Post#: 206--------------------------------------------------
Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: Fifebuoy
Date: June 19, 2023, 5:09 am
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On Friday 21st April I parked in a disc parking zone (Hide Hill)
in Berwick Upon Tweed for about 20 mins. The allowed time is 1
hour (no return within 2 hours). When I returned to the car a
parking attendant was giving me a ticket for overstaying, this
is a Code 30. I had accidentally put the time on the disc to be
an hour early. However I could easily prove that I was elsewhere
an hour before the ticket was given as I had receipts from
Morrisons, which is a couple of miles away (and on the day,
about a 15 min journey due to roadworks).
In summary I parked at approx 11.25am but set my disc to 10.25
and was given the ticket at 11.44
HTML https://i.imgur.com/IVMJBV3.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/3BbaTHJ.jpeg
Traffic Order for Hide Hill
HTML https://www.northumberland.gov.uk/Northumbe.../TRO-006-21.pdf
My informal appeal on the grounds that I didn't overstay was
rejected:
TRAFFIC MANAGEMENT ACT 2004
Penalty Charge Notice: NV05163371
Issue Date: 21/04/2023
Location: Hide Hill
Vehicle Registration: NK13VGX
Thank you for writing to us and for your supporting evidence.
After considering your challenge we have decided not to cancel
your Penalty Charge Notice
(PCN).
The signage where you parked states: ‘Disc Zone, Mon – Sat, 9am
– 5:30pm, 1 hour, no
return within 2 hours’.
You were given a PCN as the Civil Enforcement Officer (CEO)
believed you had overstayed
the 1 hour time limit.
You have stated that you set your parking disc an hour early in
error. Although you may not
have overstayed the time limit in place your parking disc showed
the time of arrival at
approximately 10:15 and your PCN was correctly issued at 11:44.
The front of the disc has 'ARRIVAL TIME' under the red arrow.
The reverse of the disc under
‘Instructions for use’ state:
1. Set your disc to the time of arrival
2. Display the disc inside the windscreen, so the time can be
clearly seen
3. Please check the signs for the maximum stay and other
restrictions
4. You have committed a parking offence if you:-
• Park and fail to display the disc clearly
• Indicate a false time of arrival-perhaps mistakenly
• Subsequently alter the time on the disc
• Exceed the maximum stay
Parking Services, County Hall, Morpeth, Northumberland, NE61 2EF
(T) 0345 600 6400 (W) www.northumberland.gov.uk
Whilst we appreciate your explanation as outlined in your
challenge, regrettably this would not
be a reason for us to cancel your PCN. It remains the driver’s
responsibility to ensure the time
of the parking disc is set correctly before leaving their
vehicle.
Please be advised that the council will not consider any further
informal challenges
against this PCN. This will not prevent the owner/registered
keeper making a further
formal appeal in response to a Notice to Owner.
I have now received the NTO and am intending to reply saying
that I wasn't parked for more than an hour, and can prove it,
and thus the contravention didn't occur. Help with wording
appreciated!
My initial proposed response is: "The time and date of the
alleged contravention is 11:44 on 21/04/2023. Parking is allowed
for 1 hour. However as can be seen from the attached receipt I
was at Morrison's at 11:09 that morning, less than an hour
before 11:44. Therefore the contravention "Parking longer than
permitted" has not, and could not possibly, have occured."
I originally posted this on pepipoo.com, link below to the
original discussion there.
Link to Pepipoo posts
HTML http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=149583&st=0&p=1783251&#entry1783251
#Post#: 208--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: June 19, 2023, 5:35 am
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Sorry if this sounds silly, but your representations needs
expanding a bit: Where is Morrisons? How does the fact that you
were not at morrisons prove you couldn't have overstayed?
I imagine what you mean is that the distance from Morrisons is X
and you couldn't have walked X distance in the time that would
be necessary for the CEO to observe the car, but this all needs
to be spelt out. After all, the person reading the letter might
have no idea where Morrisons is.
#Post#: 221--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: Fifebuoy
Date: June 19, 2023, 7:45 am
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Morrisons is about 1.5 miles from Hide Hill where I parked, a
journey which on the day took about 15 mins due to roadworks. I
filled the car up at the Morrisons petrol station at 11.09 and
have the receipt to show this. I also did some shopping in the
supermarket before filling up. I then drove to Hide Hill, parked
at about 11.25, completed my business and returned to the car at
11.45.
My point being that as I was at Morrisons at 11.09 I couldn't
also have been parked at Hide Hill at 10.45 and thus couldn't
possibly have overstayed.
Best to spell all this out in my reply then?
#Post#: 223--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: June 19, 2023, 8:51 am
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--- Quote from: Fifebuoy link ---
>
> Best to spell all this out in my reply then?
>
--- End Quote ---
Yes definitely, the person considering the representation might
be an outsourced person who lives on the other side of the
county. Post a revised draft and I'll check it over for you.
#Post#: 237--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: Fifebuoy
Date: June 19, 2023, 5:18 pm
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How about:
This contravention Code 30 "Parked for longer than permitted"
did not occur.
On the morning of 21/04 I went to the Morrisons supermarket at
the north end of Berwick, where I did some shopping and the
filled up my car with petrol. The time on the receipt is 11.09.
I then drove to Hide Hill, a distance of approximately 1.5
miles, the journey taking about 15 minutes (longer than usual
due to roadworks). I therefore arrived at Hide Hill at
approximately 11.25.
I returned to the car to be given a PCN, with a time noted of
11.44; this was based on my parking disc which I had
inadvertently set to an hour earlier, and thus the CEO believed
I had been there for more than an hour.
However this is not the case, as the times on the receipts at
Morrisons demonstrate. As I did not overstay the contravention
did not occur.
#Post#: 307--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: June 21, 2023, 4:43 pm
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Yes for an informal representation that's fine, send it off and
let's see what they say.
#Post#: 355--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: Fifebuoy
Date: June 22, 2023, 4:51 pm
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I've already done an informal representation, which was
(predictably) rejected.
I've now got the NTO and need to respond formally. Not sure if
it needs any more than this?
#Post#: 385--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: June 23, 2023, 9:42 am
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Would you be able to annotate a print-out of google maps showing
the location of morrisons relative to where the car was parked?
Also please post up the NTO.
#Post#: 464--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: Fifebuoy
Date: June 25, 2023, 5:35 pm
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Map attached - best I can do to show Morrisons and Hide Hill
Scans of the NTO attached. There's also a form I can fill in to
write my representations.
NTO p1
HTML https://imgur.com/3bDvfnS
NTO p2
HTML https://imgur.com/xg6VK4B
NTO p3
HTML https://imgur.com/Vkrpf7L
NTO p4
HTML https://imgur.com/1NjVclK
NTO p5
HTML https://imgur.com/pMxtSZ2
Map of Berwick
HTML https://imgur.com/N5opHEJ
#Post#: 476--------------------------------------------------
Re: Northumberland CC Penalty Code 30
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: June 26, 2023, 7:03 am
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Send representations online via the council website (we don't
want to take any risks with the post), and get a screenshot of
the confirmation screen:
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Dear Northumberland County Council,
I challenge liability for PCN NV05163371 on the basis that the
alleged contravention did not occur.
I parked at 11:25 but unfortunately set the time in error to
10:25 am, and a PCN was issued at 11:44 am. I can prove my car
cannot have been parked where it was since 10:25 am, because I
was at Morrisons at 11:09 am, I attach a receipt as proof of
this.
As you can see from the attached map, the distance from
Morrisons is such that a return trip on foot would have taken at
least an hour, and nobody in their right mind would park their
car on Hide Hill and then walk over an hour to Morrisons and
back, considering Morrisons has a free car park. In any event
one of the Morrisons receipts is for petrol, which shows I must
have travelled there with my car.
While I appreciate it's my fault for setting the wrong time on
the clock, the clock merely provides an indication of the time
of parking and is not conclusive proof. The contravention
alleged is not "displaying an expired clock" or words to that
effect, the contravention is parking for longer than permitted.
As that contravention did not occur, I kindly ask you to cancel
the PCN.
Yours faithfully,
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Please post up the response when you get it.
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