DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
FreeTrafficLegalAdvice
HTML https://ftla.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so ...
*****************************************************
#Post#: 55379--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: January 27, 2025, 10:20 am
---------------------------------------------------------
This needs a redraft. It's an informal challenge. The decision I
posted needs careful handling.
First though - do you have proof you only parked for 45 minutes?
#Post#: 55414--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: Felics
Date: January 27, 2025, 1:21 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I don't have any proof aside from me leaving my house and coming
back (via my Ring Doorbell).
#Post#: 55456--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: January 27, 2025, 5:10 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Any receipts from shopping? It would help if you can line up the
under 1 hour - your doorbell could do - as the case I posted was
predicated on the first adjudicator finding that it was under
the free hour.
I would say:
I challenge the PCN because the alleged contravention of parked
without payment of the parking charge cannot apply as I ensured
my visit to local shops took well under the free hour allowed.
In any case I did manage to obtain a ticket not long after
parking (see enclosed).
I believe I am on firm ground here in saying that the
contravention did not occur because a parking charge is not due
for the first hour.
I look forward to your early conformation of cancellation of the
PCN.
#Post#: 55551--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: Felics
Date: January 28, 2025, 9:05 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I have a shopping receipt showing 1.20PM and also ring doorbells
screenshot below (conveniently showing the PCN still on my dash
as I hadnt yet spotted it!)
First is of me leaving with timestamp and second of me returning
with timestamp. Car in the drive.
HTML https://i.imgur.com/gOUQCie.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/NAdQv7e.jpeg
Do you think that would suffice? Should I also send these bits
of evidence to Redbridge in my initial appeal?
#Post#: 55577--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: January 28, 2025, 10:01 am
---------------------------------------------------------
It supports your case, so put it in.
Don't be shocked if they reject your reps, because councils
refuse almost all informal reps because they know that if they
do, most people then just cough-up, thus maintaining their "nice
little earner". Councils keep all the money from PCN payments,
did you know that ?
#Post#: 55580--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: Felics
Date: January 28, 2025, 10:07 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Incandescent link ---
>
> It supports your case, so put it in.
>
> Don't be shocked if they reject your reps, because councils
refuse almost all informal reps because they know that if they
do, most people then just cough-up, thus maintaining their "nice
little earner". Councils keep all the money from PCN payments,
did you know that ?
>
--- End Quote ---
The optimist thought the councils existed for the greater good
of the borough. ???
#Post#: 55594--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: January 28, 2025, 11:18 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Felics link ---
>
> [quote author=Incandescent link=topic=4834.msg55577#msg55577
date=1738080075]
> It supports your case, so put it in.
>
> Don't be shocked if they reject your reps, because councils
refuse almost all informal reps because they know that if they
do, most people then just cough-up, thus maintaining their "nice
little earner". Councils keep all the money from PCN payments,
did you know that ?
>
--- End Quote ---
The optimist thought the councils existed for the greater good
of the borough. ???
[/quote]
But who decides what that 'greater good' is ?
#Post#: 61297--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: Felics
Date: March 8, 2025, 5:48 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hello,
NTO received a few days ago.
Thoughts on how to proceed?
HTML https://i.imgur.com/GZoScHU.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/fStmkUz.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/voo5Dxk.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/Y9TeQ7S.jpeg
#Post#: 61351--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: March 8, 2025, 10:07 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Reps should be stating that the contravention did not occur as
no parking charge was due in the first hour, and you have
evidence you were parked for less than an hour.
Here are other possible cases that could be quoted.
-----------
Case reference
Appellant
Authority
VRM
PCN Details
PCN
Contravention date
Contravention time
Contravention location
Penalty amount
Contravention
Referral date
Decision Date
Adjudicator
Appeal decision
Direction
Owner.
Reasons
to “pay” for something which is free, and for which, by
definition, no payment is required. The Appeal is allowed on
this ground and it is unnecessary to examine the other issued
raised by the Appellant.
------------
Case reference 2240428886
Appellant Ololade Oluyoye
Authority London Borough of Barking and Dagenham
VRM VX72PCF
PCN Details
PCN BZ61951006
Contravention date 02 Aug 2024
Contravention time 12:11:00
Contravention location Clockhouse Avenue
Penalty amount GBP 80.00
Contravention Parked without payment of the parking charge
Referral date -
Decision Date 24 Oct 2024
Adjudicator Edward Houghton
Appeal decision Appeal allowed
Direction cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and the Notice to
Owner.
Reasons I heard the Appellant in person.
I see no reason at all to doubt her evidence as to what
occurred. Essentially on parking her vehicle she immediately
began to attempt to make payment but was delayed as a result of
poor reception /problems with the app. The PCN was issued whilst
she was in the process of attempting to pay.
On parking a vehicle in any sort of bay the motorist is allowed
a reasonable time to do whatever is necessary to validate the
parking, in this case to make a payment. What is a reasonable
time is a question of fact in all the circumstances of the case,
and the motorist must of course act promptly. It seems to me
that it is inevitable that the technology will not always work
as it should and that some reasonable allowance must be made in
this situation (although the time would of course eventually
come when the motorist has to give up and use another method of
payment). On the facts of the present case I am satisfied the
Appellant had not exceeded the reasonable time allowable and
that, as it transpires, the PCN was not correctly issued.
The Appeal would also fall to be allowed for two more
fundamental reasons. The Council has provided an Amending
Traffic Management Order but this is of little value in the
absence of the “Parent” order which it amends. In the absence of
that Order it is impossible to be satisfied that payment was
required or if so how it was to be made.
In addition, it appears that the parking session in question was
free. If something is “free” payment is not required for it; and
unless the TMO contains some particular provision dealing with
this point and issuing a PCN for a failure to “pay” is
incorrect.
---------
Case reference 2240441669
Appellant June Rosetta Greenhalf
Authority London Borough of Havering
VRM AC03JAG
PCN Details
PCN HG34158396
Contravention date 29 May 2024
Contravention time 12:20:00
Contravention location Keswick Avenue Car Park
Penalty amount GBP 60.00
Contravention Parked without payment of the parking charge
Referral date -
Decision Date 05 Nov 2024
Adjudicator Sean Stanton-Dunne
Appeal decision Appeal allowed
Direction cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and the Notice to
Owner.
Reasons Mrs Greenhalf has attended the hearing today with her
husband, Mr Keith Greenhalf.
This PCN was issued for the alleged contravention of being
parked in Keswick Avenue Car Park without payment of the parking
charge.
Mrs Greenhalf says that the car was parked for around 15 minutes
and the CEO recorded a 6 minute observation period before the
PCN was issued. The signage for the car park confirms that the
first 30 minutes of parking is free. I accept Mrs Greenhalf's
evidence. It follows that there was no parking charge payable.
I have also looked at the images of the tariff board supplied by
Mrs Greenhalf. I can see no instruction to motorists that they
must register a parking session with Ringo to have the benefit
of the free parking period and the conditions of use do not warn
motorists of any liability to receive a PCN for failing to
register a free parking session.
I allow the appeal for these reasons.
------------
#Post#: 61388--------------------------------------------------
Re: London Borough of Redbridge - Cameron Road IG3 - Parked
without payment of parking
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: March 8, 2025, 2:10 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
The key message is that you must not ignore the NtO because if
you do, you lose all subsequent rights to contest it.
Receipt of an NtO means the discount option has gone, so it is a
total no-brainer to take them all the way to London Tribunals.
However, first you must submit your reps again, this time
against the NtO.
*****************************************************
Page 2 of 4
DIR Previous Page
DIR Next Page