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#Post#: 54494--------------------------------------------------
"Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: pipo6066
Date: January 22, 2025, 7:24 am
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Hello I received this very amateurish/scam looking NTK,
While I believe there's a chance the vehicle was waiting there
at the time, it was well past midnight on a rainy night and no
'private parking' signs where in sight, I'm sure that if there
were the car wasn't waiting there.
Is it legal for them to send this 3 months after the alleged
event?? Thanks for any help or advice, I don't want this to get
to debt collectors but this level of low effort screams
injustice. Thank you!
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 54504--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: jfollows
Date: January 22, 2025, 8:16 am
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They can send this when they like, they have six years under
contract law, but they’re too late to transfer liability to the
registered keeper (you) from the driver (unknown) and you have
no obligation to name the driver.
You already have a reply written for you in the other thread you
have commented on.
And it’s not a “fine”, it’s a highly speculative invoice.
#Post#: 54512--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: baroudeur
Date: January 22, 2025, 8:35 am
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A space often used, out of working hours, by cars waiting to
pick up passengers from Luton Airport as the road and verge are
covered by council DRL cameras
The boundary between the highway and the private property is
where the council's double red lines and the private double
yellow lines meet.
HTML https://tinyurl.com/e8f3c2pc
#Post#: 54518--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: pipo6066
Date: January 22, 2025, 8:58 am
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OK so I send them that reply? And they'll go away? I don't want
to discover I have debt collectors waiting...
Also looking at the 'evidence' these photos were taken by mobile
phones at different times and at least one photo is faked (the
'time' photos hoped on the photo) differs substantially from teh
time in the file metadata when it was taken, isn't this criminal
forgery of 'evidence'? You can easily check this by looking at
the image file properties -> Details on your computer...
#Post#: 54536--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: jfollows
Date: January 22, 2025, 9:39 am
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Send the reply, then ignore anything else you receive,
especially from debt collectors, and only take action if you
receive a genuine letter before claim or court notification.
Your letter is to tell them you’re not a mug and you haven’t
fallen for their threats.
Debt collectors are powerless, they have the same legal status
as I do if I write to you demanding money, ie none. Read this
forum more.
Don’t bother “appealing” to the IAS either, it’s a sham and
nobody here wastes time and effort with it.
#Post#: 54543--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: DWMB2
Date: January 22, 2025, 9:55 am
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--- Quote ---
> Don’t bother “appealing” to the IAS either, it’s a sham and
nobody here wastes time and effort with it.
--- End Quote ---
Whilst I'd ordinarily agree, we have seen some success with very
clear non-PoFA cases, like this one.
#Post#: 54545--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: b789
Date: January 22, 2025, 9:56 am
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For heavens sake... stop going on about useless "debt
collectors". You must be low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree
if you think that a debt collector can do anything about this
alleged debt. They can't. All they can do is try and get you to
poop your pants and pay up out of ignorance and fear.
The debt collector is not a party to the contract allegedly
breached by the driver and there is absolutely nothing they can
do that can affect you. Ignore any debt collector if you ever
get one.
That Parking Charge Notice (PCN), issued as a postal Notice to
Keeper (NtK) cannot hold the Keeper liable because it is not
compliant with all the requirements of PoFA. They have no idea
who the driver is unless you blab it to them, inadvertently or
otherwise. There is no legal obligation on the Keeper to
identify the driver to an unregulated private parking company
and you should not bab the drivers identity by saying stupid
things like "I did this or that". You are the Keeper and you
always refer to the driver in the third person such as "The
driver did this or that". Do you understand so far?
I have no idea what "reply" you are referring to but I suggest
you send the following, only as the Keeper, as your appeal to
this Mickey Mouse bunch of ex-clampers:
--- Quote ---
> Easy one to defeat... as long as the unknown drivers identity
is not revealed. There is no legal obligation on the known
keeper (the recipient of the Notice to Keeper (NtK)) to reveal
the identity of the unknown driver and no inference or
assumptions can be made.
>
> The NtK is not compliant with all the requirements of PoFA
which means that if the unknown driver is not identified, they
cannot transfer liability for the charge from the unknown driver
to the known keeper.
>
> Use the following as your appeal. No need to embellish or
remove anything from it:
>
> [quote]I am the keeper of the vehicle and I dispute your
'parking charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement
and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to
your client landowner.
>
> As your Notice to Keeper (NtK) does not fully comply with ALL
the requirements of PoFA 2012, you are unable to hold the keeper
of the vehicle liable for the charge. Partial or even
substantial compliance is not sufficient. There will be no
admission as to who was driving and no inference or assumptions
can be drawn. UPE has relied on contract law allegations of
breach against the driver only.
>
> The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have
been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation
of the law of agency. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable.
UOE have no hope at IAS, so you are urged to save us both a
complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.
--- End Quote ---
[/quote]
Don't be surprised though if they reject the appeal. They are
scammers and they are hoping you are stupid enough to not
realise and pay up. An IAS appeal would be futile but you may as
well try one if they reject the initial appeal.
As long as you follow our advice and don't overthink this and
stop panicking about useless debt collector letters, you won't
be paying a penny to these ex-clampers.
#Post#: 54594--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: pipo6066
Date: January 22, 2025, 1:21 pm
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--- Quote from: baroudeur link ---
>
> A space often used, out of working hours, by cars waiting to
pick up passengers from Luton Airport as the road and verge are
covered by council DRL cameras
>
> The boundary between the highway and the private property is
where the council's double red lines and the private double
yellow lines meet.
>
>
HTML https://tinyurl.com/e8f3c2pc
>
--- End Quote ---
Thanks for this,
Looking at the excellent google maps photo, can a private firm
issue 'charges' on council double red lines - assuming they are
not properly contracted by the council? Do they have
'jurisdiction'? Can these be grounds for 'appeal'? Thank you
#Post#: 54613--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Universal parking enforcement" - NTK 'Kelly's
Storage' Luton
DIR By: b789
Date: January 22, 2025, 5:10 pm
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They’re not “council double red lines”. The entrance is private
land and they can paint rainbow lines if they want and create
any terms. However, they sneakily continue the official red line
onto the private property.
Stop overthinking this. Just send the appeal and wait for the
response.
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