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#Post#: 57409--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: February 10, 2025, 6:24 am
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I think that letter is a reply to your letter following up their
initial rejection.
You haven't yet been served with an NTO? Confirm this.
#Post#: 57410--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: FuzzedRinggit
Date: February 10, 2025, 6:26 am
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No I don't think I have (NTO = Notice of rejection?) The only
letter I have received is this one above from the local
authority so I presume no NTO.
I'll wait for that to arrive, thank you!
#Post#: 57412--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: February 10, 2025, 6:30 am
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NTO is notice to owner and is the formal document served on the
registered keeper.
I expect we've asked you but are you the keeper and is the V5C
logbook address correct.
Nothing you can do until you get this.
#Post#: 57417--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: FuzzedRinggit
Date: February 10, 2025, 6:47 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes I am and the addresses are correct. Thanks for your help.
#Post#: 57522--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: February 10, 2025, 3:16 pm
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This is petty. I have checked the website and they are still
asking for the £60.
#Post#: 57523--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: FuzzedRinggit
Date: February 10, 2025, 3:19 pm
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They are yes. The tone of the letter makes it sound like there
is no other option but to pay the fine, no mention of the NTO or
what to do if you disagree with their decision.
It also stinks that they don't change the website to show that
there's been an informal appeal made. I had to ask on here what
happens next because the website makes it look like you have to
appeal on there again because there's no update. Totally
confusing.
#Post#: 57553--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: February 11, 2025, 3:27 am
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OP, it's only confusing if you attach weight to the council's
ignorance.
This is the enforcement process:
HTML https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/parking-penalty-charge-notice-enforcement-process
I don't wish to sound harsh, but this thread is already 4 pages
long and you don't yet have a NTO. We know that some councils'
actions can be frustrating, but c'est la vie.
Pl just wait for the NTO.
#Post#: 57972--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: February 13, 2025, 10:04 am
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Spotted these cases in Bromley from yesterday's tribunal.
Shows how some adjudicators are wise to this and that an appeal
needs to be prepared for those who aren't.
The first allowed case is actually for signed bays; the second
(refused by Mr Burke) I think is in one the unsigned bays as
with the case in this thread.
------------
Case reference 2240567623
Authority London Borough of Bromley
Contravention date 04 Aug 2024
Contravention time 16:45:00
Contravention location Elmfield Road
Penalty amount GBP 80.00
Contravention Not parked correctly within markings of bay/space
Decision Date 12 Feb 2025
Adjudicator Edward Houghton
Appeal decision Appeal allowed
Direction cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and the Notice to
Owner.
Reasons I heard this appeal by telephone speaking to the driver
Mr xxxxx.
His case is essentially that he parked in good faith and that
there was no notice requiring him to park within the bay
markings.
It is certainly, in my view, common sense that if a parking
place is divided into parking places by white lines within the
bay the motorist is expected to park within those lines. What
else, after all, are they there to indicate? However the issue
is whether the lines of themselves indicate that they are there
not merely for guidance but that it is a legal requirement that
vehicles park within them. Although it is not uncommon it is
(and I speak from experience) by no means universally the case
that Traffic Management Orders create such a legal requirement
and it seems to me the motorist is entitled to be put on notice
in a case where the particular TMO imposes such a requirement.
In the circumstances I am not satisfied that it can be said the
restriction relied on was sufficiently clearly indicated and the
Appel is therefore allowed.
HTML https://i.ibb.co/C5YB2zYG/br2.png
----------
Case reference 2240508511
Authority London Borough of Bromley
Contravention date 06 May 2024
Contravention time 13:38:00
Contravention location Murray Avenue
Penalty amount GBP 80.00
Contravention Not parked correctly within markings of bay/space
Decision Date 12 Feb 2025
Adjudicator Michael Burke
Appeal decision Appeal refused
Direction Full penalty charge notice amount stated to be paid
within 28 days.
Reasons The allegation in this case is that the vehicle was not
parked correctly within the markings of a bay or space. The
Appellant does not dispute this but says that bushes and trees
overhung the space making it impossible to park any closer to
the kerb. They say that they needed to allow space at the
passenger side to allow their 6 year old son who is autistic to
alight. The Appellant asserts a number of failures by the
Enforcement Authority in road maintenance.
The Enforcement Authority have provided photographs taken by the
Civil Enforcement Officer which show a clear example of the
contravention with the vehicle proud of the lateral bay markings
by something like 18ins to 2ft.
The photographs do show overhanging foliage. There may be merit
in the Appellant’s criticisms. However, if for any reason there
is insufficient space to fit the entire vehicle within the bay
markings, then the bay is not available and the motorist must
find an alternative place to park.
The Appellant has not established anything which goes beyond
mitigation. The Enforcement Authority may cancel a PCN as a
matter of their discretion. An Adjudicator has no power to
direct cancellation on the basis of mitigating circumstances.
Having considered all the evidence I am satisfied that the
contravention occurred and that the PCN was properly issued and
served. I am not satisfied that any exemption applies.
HTML https://i.ibb.co/S77XFDtW/br1.png
#Post#: 64711--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: FuzzedRinggit
Date: March 29, 2025, 2:56 am
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Well, Bromley have replied to my appeal. Here's the letter.
Spoiler: they aren't cancelling the PCN.
I will make representation. Any advice helpful!
Ringgitt
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 64734--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bromley - PCN is this Not Parking Correctly within the
markings of the bay?
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: March 29, 2025, 6:29 am
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Did they send you a notice to owner? What is this latest letter
in response to?
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