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#Post#: 41676--------------------------------------------------
PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: ErinFury
Date: October 21, 2024, 7:59 am
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I had to collect some items from a shop that was ceasing trading
the following day and parked in the loading bay outside. I
started a timer the moment I parked and took a photo of the shop
as soon as I left the car (because I was sad to see it go) and
the time on that photo was 1606. The traffic warden started the
three minute timer literally two minutes later at 1608, while I
was in the queue to speak to the owner.
The item I was collecting didn't appear to be working and the
owner had to have a fiddle with the item to see why not, in
those few minutes I took the opportunity to take some video of
the shop and even into the shop corridor outside and I caught on
tape the fact that I already had a ticket!
By the time I got to the car to see I had been given a ticket I
looked at my timer and according to it I still had 6 minutes
left. I did not leave the shop other than to go into the shop.
(I may have briefly stepped outside on the pavement to video the
front of the shop but went straight back in) and by then my
goods were ready.
There will be CCTV of the street I'm sure as it's a very busy
road and the council must make a lot of money issuing tickets
there. I just feel this is very unfair.
Anyway, I took a photo of my car in the bay and if they had
given me a ticket for my wheels being outside of the bay
markings they would have been bang to rights, but they did not,
so I feel I should fight it. Can I charge them for the admin
time? I could so do without all this. Anyway, hope you can help.
I used to have an account on PepiPoo and you guys have always
helped so much and I'm so grateful you're still here.
Front of PCN:
HTML https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/4069/g2dWQv.jpg
Back of PCN:
HTML https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5984/BWay7V.jpg
Image of Car in Bay:
HTML https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/1430/ezCkYj.jpg
Location of Vehicle/Shop:
HTML https://maps.app.goo.gl/ZcTtzBippSo3zjdq5
Screenshot of Timer:
HTML https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/2074/EpKnCV.png
#Post#: 41697--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: October 21, 2024, 9:29 am
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I had to collect some items from a shop
By the time I got to the car to see I had been given a ticket I
looked at my timer and according to it I still had 6 minutes
left. I did not leave the shop other than to go into the shop.
(I may have briefly stepped outside on the pavement to video the
front of the shop but went straight back in) and by then my
goods were ready.
OP, subject to any council policy regarding a minimum period of
observation for this contravention, whether the PCN is unfair
depends upon you fleshing out your account. As it stands, the
CEO was perfectly correct in issuing a PCN because all they
could see was a parked car. You might have known what was going
on away from the car, but how would the CEO?
So:
Collecting - were you collecting or were you shopping e.g. had
goods been put aside awaiting collection or were you simply
browsing with the possibility that you would emerge with
nothing?
What were the items?
#Post#: 41706--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: ErinFury
Date: October 21, 2024, 9:50 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi, I have found the receipts for when they were dropped in for
the two items that I was having repaired, both were lights. It
took more than three mintues for the owner to get to me in the
queue and then locate said items and to show me they were
working. One receipt is dated 3rd August and the other 9th Sept.
Life had gotten in the way of collecting them and it became
really important as the shop was closing.
#Post#: 41711--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: October 21, 2024, 10:03 am
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I suggest you start any challenge at the beginning and continue
with simple facts.
Perhaps:
On ** and ** I took ** and *** into *** to have them repaired,
see enclosed receipts. I was contacted on approx. **** to tell
me the items were ready for collection. On 18 October, I parked
in the loading bay outside the shop and went in to collect the
items. You may or may not be aware that *** was closing
permanently on 19th, therefore 18th was my last practical
opportunity to collect the items.
When I got inside there was something of a queue- presumably
because others were aware that it was closing- and so I had to
wait a couple of minutes to be served. Even then, I asked the
owner to show that the items were working because any faults
obviously couldn't be rectified later. He did so quickly and I
then took my items and returned to my car.
Would my approach. If there's anything factually incorrect then
pl amend.
#Post#: 41798--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: October 21, 2024, 6:36 pm
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[member=3094]ErinFury[/member] I've ordered the traffic order,
but in the meantime please can you confirm how heavy / bulky
these lights were? Do you have photos of the boxes they were in?
#Post#: 41801--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: Chaseman
Date: October 21, 2024, 7:00 pm
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Erin
The key to this is how heavy/bulky the lights were and hence cp
8759's question and how reasonable it was to park in the loading
bay in order to collect them. I would suggest if chandeliers
then the answer is yes and if modest desk lights probably no.
Here's the bible on loading. Now old but principles still apply.
You will find cases in here to support your appeal. Look at the
section headed "paperwork and other delays" on p7.
HTML https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/sites/default/files/keycases/LOADADJ.pdf
#Post#: 42469--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: October 26, 2024, 7:44 am
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[member=3094]ErinFury[/member] I've got hold of the traffic
order which is The Ealing (Free Loading Places) Order 2017
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1PzDhTf9wKgBZ52JItuX8vy0_movGkBd0/view,<br
/>the relevant entry is item 19 on page 12.
I also replied to your email but have not heard back?
#Post#: 42617--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: ErinFury
Date: October 27, 2024, 10:55 am
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Thanks ever so much [member=1]cp8759[/member]. I will craft a
letter (thanks for tips on format @HCAndersen) and put it in as
soon as I can.
Would it be considered unnecessarily antagonistic to use
Tribunal case references as per [member=65]Chaseman[/member]'s
documentation? Or is it better to go in looking like the
layperson I am?
It's already over a week since it's issue and I probably don't
have much longer to get my appeal in.
Best
Erin
#Post#: 42618--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN Not Loading while Parked in a Loading Bay, 3 mins timer
started 2 mins after parking.
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: October 27, 2024, 10:57 am
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[member=3094]ErinFury[/member] it's an informal representation,
not an appeal, please don't mix the two terms as it could cause
all manner of problems and confusion.
Because it's only an informal representation there's no massive
rush, I suggest you start by posting a draft on here for review
in the first instance.
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