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#Post#: 38756--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: steamingbanana
Date: September 28, 2024, 4:29 pm
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I found this from a neighbouring Hertfordshire Council - Dacorum
- it's from 2019 but I guess it is still relevant -
HTML https://democracy.dacorum.gov.uk/ieDecisionDetails.aspx?ID=1325
Of particular interest:
equired procedure for creation of new taxi ranks
There are two procedures that need to be followed to effectively
create new taxi ranks. The use of a Traffic Regulation Order
under the provisions of the Road Traffic Act 1984, ss32-37,
establishes restrictions to who can use the location, preventing
other vehicles from parking in the ranks, and giving the Council
the ability to take enforcement action when this happens. This
is the most significant part of the overall process. Project
Centre has been approached for a quote in regards to this
process, and their proposal document is attached.
In addition to this there is a set process under the Local
Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1976, s63 which gives
the Licensing Authority control over the stand, allowing
enforcement to take place against misuse of the rank. Before
appointing any stand for hackney carriages, the Council must
give notice to the police and must also arrange a public notice
of the proposal to appear in the local newspaper if any written
objections or representations are received within twenty-eight
days of the notice, these have to be taken into consideration.
So - what we're saying here is that there is no evidence that
East Herts Council have done the second bit?
Is all that is required from that the "notification" in the
local press? If so - then it might be that the did do this?
Whether I could find it or not is doubtful?
I found this:
HTML https://publicnoticeportal.uk/notice/traffic-and-roads/654b6b6bfb9e9390728cc587
This also confirms that this was a change to make the temporary
arrangements in place since May 2022 permanent
I read something within those temporary arrangements that this
so called taxi rank I parked in was intended as a "waiting area
for taxis before joining the taxi rank (Which I included GSV
links to previously)" - this taxi rank is out of view of the
"waiting area" - but a paper from the local town council showed
that "Taxi Marshalls" were present - so presumably to alert taxi
drivers that they can join the rank around the corner - if said
Taxi Marshalls were present when I parked - I may have bee
pre-warned.
Anyway - it's getting late - but many thanks to you all for your
help.
#Post#: 38947--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: steamingbanana
Date: September 30, 2024, 11:30 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi - just bumping this requesting final wording for any appeal
please.
Is it just a case of putting words together along the lines of
the "said contravention" did not occur as the space has not been
correctly regulated?
Sorry - don't know the full procedure. I didn't want to make it
too much "layman speak" if what is required is "technical".
Many thanks
#Post#: 38964--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: September 30, 2024, 3:37 pm
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Try this:
I am challenging the PCN on two counts.
First, I have been a regular visitor to Hertford and have been
used to parking in limited stay bays and was not aware that
anything had changed. I am aware of bays demarcated for specific
uses including taxis and disabled drivers where I am accustomed
to seeing road legends for such bays but there were none in this
bay.
Second, I have done some research and see that you have used a
traffic order under the Road Traffic Regulation 1984 Act rather
than designating a hackney stand under the Local Government
(Miscellaneous Provisions) 1976 Act. So a correct contravention
for waiting on the yellow line is 01 - Parked in a restricted
street during prescribed hours. The contravention alleged of
"Parked on a taxi rank" did not occur because there is no taxi
rank made under the correct order.
I invite you to consider my challenge and look forward to your
early cancellation of the PCN.
#Post#: 46684--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: steamingbanana
Date: November 22, 2024, 11:18 am
---------------------------------------------------------
After nearly two months - the response to my appeal came back -
and disappointingly my PCN has not been cancelled - there wasn't
really much details as to why it wasn't cancelled - just
reiteration of where I parked and my responsibility as a
motorist to check all signs.
"I have investigated the circumstances raised in your
correspondence and have made the decision to not cancel your
notice. The reasons for my decision are set out below, along
with the options available to you at this stage.
The bay in which you parked operates as a taxi rank Friday and
Saturday 6pm – 8am. This is stated on the sign. At other times
the bay offers limited parking. As the bay has a dual
restriction, there is no requirement to mark the carriageway
with the words ‘taxi bay’, motorists must rely upon the sign
adjacent to the bay in use.
The Restricted Parking Zone is indicated as required by the
Department of Transport and stipulated in the Traffic Signs
Regulations and General Directions. Local Authorities are
required to adhere to these Regulations when signing on-street
parking restrictions."
So I guess now it's a case of paying up?
Or do I take to tribunal - with a beefed up defence from the
similar case to mine (also on this forum) which was defeated at
tribunal?
I do feel that the fact that when I returned a week later and
there were so many cars with PCNs on the same street/within the
same taxi rank does make me believe that the signage is
inadequate or the council are misleading/trapping motorists into
getting PCNs.
Any help much appreciated.
Thanks
#Post#: 46693--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: Phantomcrusader
Date: November 22, 2024, 12:27 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
The PCN is issued by East Herts DC but the TRO is made by
Hertfordshire County Council and the CPE designation order
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2004/3310/introduction/madeis<br
/>awarded to Hertfordshire County Council. Therefore, who is the
enforcement authority? The PCN implies it's East Herts but the
legal documents point towards the county council.
If it is East Herts. Should the PCN not give the council's
formal name which is East Hertfordshire District Council rather
than the colloquial East Herts? The council's constitution
identifies them as
--- Quote ---
> 2.2 The Constitution
>
> 2.2.1 This document, and all its appendices, is the
Constitution of the East Hertfordshire District Council.
--- End Quote ---
There is also the matter of the code 45 contravention
description not complying with Annex B to the sec of state's
guidance
HTML https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/civil-enforcement-of-parking-contraventions/guidance-for-local-authorities-on-enforcing-parking-restrictions#annex-b-contravention-codes-for-civil-parking-enforcement-england-wide<br
/>which says to use this description
[table][tr][td]"45[/td]
[td][/td]
[td]Stopped on a taxi rank.[/td]
[td]‘Stopped’ may be varied to ‘waiting’."[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]
I think it is a Taxi Rank if taking the TSRGD 2016 definition
into account: “taxi rank”- an area of carriageway reserved for
use by taxis waiting to pick up passengers"
#Post#: 47497--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: steamingbanana
Date: November 28, 2024, 12:46 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for the response - There seems to be some agreement
within Hertfordshire that the County are effectively the overall
controller but they let the districts do the donkey work incl
the enforcement.
I'm not sure I could really appeal to the tribunal based on some
minor typos of their Council name.
I'm not sure I do have much chance - but it is hugely
frustrating that it clearly appears to be unclear signage -
given my very minimal evidence of going back a week later and
seeing a whole street of ticketed cars - I cannot really believe
all the users of Hertford Town centre are that desperate to
"take a chance on free parking" - so as per me, they clearly
missed the fairly minimal signage of a "part time" taxi rank -
and the clear disparity (difference) to every other taxi Rank in
Hertford at present or in the past!
Anyone else have any ideas of whether it's work me taking it to
tribunal?
Thanks.
#Post#: 47546--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: November 29, 2024, 5:32 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Send a message to cp8759 as he's the expert on the law at this
level. I think they are not justified in using the taxi rank
contravention.
#Post#: 48032--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: steamingbanana
Date: December 3, 2024, 7:39 am
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HTML https://i.imgur.com/tABNFbX.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/KszDfV1.jpeg
#Post#: 48090--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: steamingbanana
Date: December 3, 2024, 12:26 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
For completeness - this was the detail of my original "appeal"
against the PCN.
HTML https://i.imgur.com/mobArIu.jpeg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/KVsiFNi.jpeg
#Post#: 48114--------------------------------------------------
Re: East Herts Council, code 45 Parked on a taxi rank, Fore
Street, Hertford
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: December 3, 2024, 2:07 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[member=2834]steamingbanana[/member] in our experience as long
as you challenge the Notice to Owner within 14 days of the date
of issue, the council will reoffer the discount anyway if they
reject, so there's little risk in carrying on. That being said,
given the wording of paragraph 4(2) of Schedule 7 to the Traffic
Management Act 2004
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2004/18/schedule/7/part/1/crossheading/parking-contraventions-outside-greater-london,<br
/>there's a good and arguable basis to contend the contravention
cited refers to the Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions)
Act 1976
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1976/57/section/63,
and
clearly the council has not created a hackney stand under that
provision based on what we know.
It's also very likely that a formal representation on that
ground would result in a failure to consider (because the person
writing the rejection has no idea what they're doing).
If you let me know once you get the Notice to Owner, I can draft
a formal representation for you.
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