DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
FreeTrafficLegalAdvice
HTML https://ftla.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Private parking tickets
*****************************************************
#Post#: 2524--------------------------------------------------
Hitchin Unity House private PCN
DIR By: jotachin
Date: August 3, 2023, 9:32 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hello,
On the 11th July, I briefly parked in the Hitchin Unity House
car park to visit my father, who lives in Kennedy Court right
next to the car park. The car park is managed by PCM UK. At the
time of parking, the car park was completely empty and I was
visiting my father with my disabled younger brother as my father
was ill. I didn't have his blue badge present at the time as it
was with my mother, therefore resulting in me getting a ticket.
I appealed the ticket as soon as I recieved it, explaining that
it was an emergency and I had to drop my brother off at my
father's and I included images of the blue badge in the appeal,
as well as my father's proof of address. PCM of course denied my
appeal and stated that I need to have a permit to park there.
My father's complex has its own car park however it is only
accessible if you have the key to open it. The only other nearby
parking was permit restricted street parking, so naturally I
chose to park in the closest car park to my father's residence.
It baffles me slightly that I am not allowed to park for a short
while in a deserted car park to no one's inconvenience to drop
off my brother. The fine is £60 however if i choose to appeal
again it will go up to £100. The letter they sent me threatens
to take me to court after 28 days and/or debt recovery. Is there
anything i can do to counter this?
Thank you
EDIT: included a satellite image of the area I parked at and the
distance to my father's residence
[attachimg=1]
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 2537--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hitchin Unity House private PCN
DIR By: DWMB2
Date: August 3, 2023, 3:59 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Firstly, very sorry to hear about your father - I hope he's on
the mend.
Secondly, so that you are going into this with your eyes open:
there will be no quick or easy resolution to this matter, and
PCM can be a litigious company. If you want to fight this,
you'll need to be prepared for the possibility of defending this
in court (a loss at court would probably be about £200-220, so
this will depend somewhat on your attitude to risk).
In order to be able to offer detailed advice, we'll need to see
a couple of things:
- A photo of the Notice you received from PCM (Show us both
sides, redact personal information, leave on all dates and times
- Photos of the signage at the car park, showing their layout in
the car park, any signage at the entrance, and also a close up
so we can read the terms and conditions
- A copy of the appeal you submitted, and their response
Now to a couple of things from your post:
--- Quote from: jotachin link ---
>
> didn't have his blue badge present at the time [...]
> PCM of course denied my appeal and stated that I need to have
a permit to park there.
--- End Quote ---
What was the charge issued for? If it was issued for not having
a permit, then the presence or absence of a Blue Badge is
irrelevant. A blue badge does not grant any special rights on
private land, unless the signage in the car park explicitly says
so.
--- Quote from: jotachin link ---
>
> It baffles me slightly that I am not allowed to park for a
short while in a deserted car park to no one's inconvenience to
drop off my brother.
>
--- End Quote ---
By the looks of it, it is a residential car park, therefore
there's a good chance residents of the adjoining building pay
for use of the car park, with PCM hired to ensure the car park
remains for their exclusive use as paying residents. The
argument around it being empty won't fly - this is about whether
a contract was entered into or not, and the car park being empty
doesn't affect that (and at any rate, there's no way to know
whether an empty car park will remain empty throughout one's
stay).
(To note - I'll be away from tomorrow until Monday. If you don't
get any replies before then, it's not because you have been
forgotten about)
#Post#: 2548--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hitchin Unity House private PCN
DIR By: The Rookie
Date: August 4, 2023, 1:55 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Unfortunately it's not unreasonable for a landowner to want to
be able to decide who parks on their land, I'm sure you wouldn't
want someone parking on your driveway just because it's empty.
The Supreme Court has taken this view.
As this is a BPA company your best chance is a PoFA fail, so
lets see ALL the PCN, also modify that post to not give away the
driver ID, 'the driver' drove, with no I, we, he or even the
dog. You will deal with the matter as the vehicle keeper.
#Post#: 2556--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hitchin Unity House private PCN
DIR By: guest179
Date: August 4, 2023, 4:10 am
---------------------------------------------------------
As you probably know, this car park provides easy pedestrian
access to the park and fly parking was probably the bane of
residents' lives until they put in controls.
Where would you normally park when visiting your father?
#Post#: 2567--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hitchin Unity House private PCN
DIR By: jotachin
Date: August 4, 2023, 6:45 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: The Rookie link ---
>
> Unfortunately it's not unreasonable for a landowner to want to
be able to decide who parks on their land, I'm sure you wouldn't
want someone parking on your driveway just because it's empty.
>
> The Supreme Court has taken this view.
>
> As this is a BPA company your best chance is a PoFA fail, so
lets see ALL the PCN, also modify that post to not give away the
driver ID, 'the driver' drove, with no I, we, he or even the
dog. You will deal with the matter as the vehicle keeper.
>
--- End Quote ---
I have attached the original PCN letter plus the letter I
recieved after they rejected my appeal. If it comes down to it,
I might have to pay the £60 since going to court sounds tedious
and ultimately not worth it. Thank you
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 2568--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hitchin Unity House private PCN
DIR By: jotachin
Date: August 4, 2023, 6:47 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Ugly duckling link ---
>
> As you probably know, this car park provides easy pedestrian
access to the park and fly parking was probably the bane of
residents' lives until they put in controls.
>
> Where would you normally park when visiting your father?
>
--- End Quote ---
Normally I would park in the car park just below the circled
apartment building, however as my father was ill and the button
to open the gate was in his car I didn't have much of a choice.
#Post#: 2858--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hitchin Unity House private PCN
DIR By: DWMB2
Date: August 7, 2023, 2:52 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
So far from what you have posted there doesn't seem to be much
that would amount to a sound defence.
We've not yet seen the signs - the terms might be 'forbidding'
if they say 'Permit Holders Only' or similar, but this is
another point you'd probably need to try in court.
*****************************************************
Page 1 of 1