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#Post#: 41275--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: Sam6688
Date: October 17, 2024, 2:32 pm
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As we know we have appealed and waiting for tribunal date this
month. I have received the pack today with all these documents.
Can someone have a look and advise what it means. Please find
the links below for documents received today from Redbridge
council.
@MrChips
@Stamfordman
@cp8759
@Hippocrates
Thanks in Advance.
HTML https://ibb.co/mF3j1Y1
HTML https://ibb.co/v3nkfPw
HTML https://ibb.co/hKSjBj8
HTML https://ibb.co/61vjwJz
HTML https://ibb.co/7Jy0VhZ
HTML https://ibb.co/VqLcqzK
HTML https://ibb.co/XJf38Fm
HTML https://ibb.co/LJpHnN7
HTML https://ibb.co/MPR45VR
HTML https://ibb.co/CzpMryK
HTML https://ibb.co/NNhs1Mv
HTML https://ibb.co/RSdGKgP
HTML https://ibb.co/ZJxBZr1
HTML https://ibb.co/cYBtWJZ
#Post#: 41289--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: October 17, 2024, 5:36 pm
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No one is going to click on all those links as they have no
legend.
Post the council's summary - you can select BBcode links to
display the pages here.
#Post#: 41292--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: Sam6688
Date: October 17, 2024, 6:50 pm
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--- Quote from: stamfordman link ---
>
> No one is going to click on all those links as they have no
legend.
>
> Post the council's summary - you can select BBcode links to
display the pages here.
>
--- End Quote ---
Hi Sorry hope you can see it now 2 pages of council summary
Thanks
@Stamfordman
HTML https://ibb.co/rvjMcgh
HTML https://ibb.co/61vjwJz
#Post#: 41298--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: John U.K.
Date: October 18, 2024, 1:36 am
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For convenience:
HTML https://i.ibb.co/b2HcmRT/20241017-195444.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/61vjwJz
HTML https://i.ibb.co/BwpjrmJ/20241017-195451.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/rvjMcgh
#Post#: 41308--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: October 18, 2024, 3:59 am
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This is awful for Redbridge - they seem to have someone who
doesn't understand the law and thinks you can pick the stopping
part in isolation from the owing to stationary vehicles part.
#Post#: 41335--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: October 18, 2024, 5:54 am
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Just working on this. Also, a serious failure to consider the
locus issue, save for their comments in their summary.
Dear Sirs
I make these further submissions in support of having M**** case
allowed.
1. The appellant has made sensible and coherent submissions;
but, the council has failed in its NOR to consider some of
them, even though they have mentioned these in its case summary.
Clearly, the initial failure influenced the appellant's decision
to file his appeal.
2. The NOR fails to include the form and manner since it does
not mention the power of the adjudicator to extend time in which
to appeal.
In light of the above, I ask that the appeal be allowed please.
#Post#: 41358--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: October 18, 2024, 7:44 am
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Where is a copy of the OP's reps in the council's evidence?
All I can see is a summary of those reps.
#Post#: 41411--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: Sam6688
Date: October 18, 2024, 3:06 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> Where is a copy of the OP's reps in the council's evidence?
>
> All I can see is a summary of those reps.
>
--- End Quote ---
Hi [member=24]Hippocrates[/member] is representing me at
tribunal against Redbridge he is in process of that.
Thanks [member=5]John U.K.[/member]
For uploading pictures.
[member=2249]stamfordman[/member] fingers crossed as we have
date in tribunal in 10 days so hopefully will get it cancelled
and Adjudicator allow the appeal.
#Post#: 42285--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: Sam6688
Date: October 25, 2024, 6:49 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: stamfordman link ---
>
> This is awful for Redbridge - they seem to have someone who
doesn't understand the law and thinks you can pick the stopping
part in isolation from the owing to stationary vehicles part.
>
--- End Quote ---
[member=2249]stamfordman[/member]
[member=43]MrChips[/member]
Good Afternoon everyone just seeking advice as Hippocrates asked
me to attend through the phone as he said I just need to tell
the court what happened on the day.
Just getting curious as I don't want to say anything which can
go against my case.
Any suggestion what shall I say on the day like why I stopped at
yellow box junction.
Good afternoon guys hope everyone is doing good.
I was only 7 or 8 seconds in junction as soon as I notice there
are cars i moved out.
Any suggesstion or help will be much appreciated.
Any advice will be appreciated thanks.
#Post#: 42294--------------------------------------------------
Re: Ilford lane redbridge Yellow box junction PCN
DIR By: MrChips
Date: October 25, 2024, 7:33 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi OP.
So, I've only ever been to the tribunal once (but it was for a
box junction and I won although the adjudicator was in my
opinion unnecessarily brusque and confrontational - hopefully
you will get a less agitated one!) so others are perhaps better
qualified to answer this.
For me, and bearing in mind we think you are starting from a
winning position, the key things are not to:
- say anything which undermines your credibility, so don't
exaggerate, try to mislead, or say anything which is clearly
contradicted by the video footage
- say anything that inadvertently suggests you are admitting the
offence which (to remind you) is to enter the box such that you
have to stop within the box due to stationary vehicles.
Re the latter, the key points are:
- it is not (necessarily) an offence to stop in the box
(whatever Redbridge may think)
- if you stop for any reason other than because stationary
vehicles force you to then that's not punishable
- consequently, because there is a vehicle sized gap in front of
you when you enter the box and also when you stop, you shouldn't
be penalised.
You shouldn't focus on (or really bring up) the fact you stopped
for 'only' 7 seconds as this isn't relevant (any stop even for
less than a second is an offence the way the law is written) so
this could distract the adjudicator into thinking that your
argument is that you should be let off for only committing an
offence for a short time, when your argument is that you didn't
commit a contravention in the first place.
You may be asked why you entered the box junction in the first
place and then stopped in it, so be prepared for that. If there
is a reason, then that might help (e.g. because you saw traffic
ahead coming to a standstill so wanted to let in the vehicle
approaching from the left but then realised you were blocking
the exit for the car wanting to turn in from the right) but
better just to say you can't remember than to make something up
which could lead the adjudicator to think you are being
economical with the truth. Ultimately it doesn't really matter
why you did if you didn't commit an offence in doing so.
Finally, if you think the adjudicator isn't being sympathetic to
this line of defence, don't forget the other item you included
in your original challenge around the location being far too
vague. This is especially true given you live so far away and
so wouldn't be familiar with the locality from the video or
photos.
Ultimately, Hippocrates is very experienced so you are in very
good hands :)
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