DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
FreeTrafficLegalAdvice
HTML https://ftla.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so ...
*****************************************************
#Post#: 33885--------------------------------------------------
Re: SALTER HILL - LAMBETH Help PCN Tribunal
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: August 20, 2024, 5:14 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes you should post a draft appeal here.
If you look on the register you'll see a lot of appeals about
Salter's Hill and most of the adjudicators will have judged one
or more no doubt. The clear pattern of allowed appeals is the
distance to the oncoming car, but the appeals could be improved
with reference to what the layout and signage indicates as the
priority zone - this in my view may have swung some marginal
refusals to allowed.
This case shows an adjudicator using critical thinking - see the
bold part. Note that Lambeth is taking an interest in this one
and continues to contest many.
-----------
At this scheduled personal hearing the Appellant was represented
by the driver Mr Kennedy, who attended in person.
The Enforcement Authority were represented by Miss Deboos-Mylet,
who attended by telephone.
A contravention can occur is a vehicle is driven so as to fail
to give way to oncoming vehicles.
There appears to be no dispute that the vehicle was in Salter's
Hill, as shown in the closed-circuit television (cctv) images
produced by the Enforcement Authority.
The Enforcement Authority’s is that the Appellant’s vehicle
passed the ‘Give Way’ sign after the oncoming vehicle has
entered Salter’s Hill.
Whilst the road narrows to an effective single lane under the
bridge, just after the ‘Give Way’ sign, the site evidence
produced by the Enforcement Authority shows that the stretch of
road from the bridge to the traffic island beyond it is much
longer than appears in the cctv images. The ‘Priority over
oncoming vehicles’ sign on the other side of the bridge is
actually just before it.
In the cctv images the oncoming vehicle is only at the traffic
island, before the speed sign and well before the traffic
calming humps.
The Diagram 615 sign (Item 9 in Part 2 of Schedule 3 to the
Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016) indicates
that priority must be given to vehicles from the opposite
direction but the requirement is not limitless and merely
because another vehicle can be seen much further down the road
does not necessarily mean that the vehicle has to wait. Each
case will turn on its own facts.
The Adjudicator is only able decide an appeal by making findings
of fact on the basis of the evidence produced by the parties and
applying relevant law.
Considering all the evidence before me carefully I cannot find
as a fact that, on this particular occasion, a contravention did
occur.
Accordingly, this appeal must be allowed.
#Post#: 34348--------------------------------------------------
Re: SALTER HILL - LAMBETH Help PCN Tribunal
DIR By: niknakpop
Date: August 23, 2024, 10:40 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi All, Thanks for all the response please see my first draft
and any feedback will be appreciated
Subject: Update on Appeal - Case Reference [Your Case Reference
Number]
Dear [Tribunal's Name/Title],
I hope this message finds you well.
I am writing to provide an update regarding my appeal against
the Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) issued to my vehicle. The case
reference number is [Your Case Reference Number].
I would like to clarify and reiterate the key points of my
appeal for your consideration:
Position of My Vehicle: At the time of the alleged
contravention, my vehicle had already passed the 'give way'
sign. The photographic evidence provided shows that the other
vehicle involved had not yet reached Salter's Hill or approached
the junction.
Compliance with Traffic Regulations: No vehicle had entered
Salter's Hill while my vehicle was at the 'give way' sign.
Traffic regulations do not require a driver to slow down or stop
in anticipation of a vehicle that is not yet visible or
oncoming.
Signage and Road Markings: The 'Give Way' line, in conjunction
with the 'Give Priority To' sign, creates the restriction.
However, the presence of the line does not alter the meaning or
extent of the sign. The restriction remains 'Give Priority To,'
and the line does not transform it into a 'Give Way'
requirement. The extent of the restriction is defined by the
sign itself, which covers the arch of the bridge. Adding a line
does not change this extent. The interpretation of the
restriction is not subject to the discretion of the council
officer on the day but is defined by the sign and its placement.
Signage and Layout Issues: Additionally, the layout and signage
at this location are poorly designed and do not clearly indicate
the priority zone. The signage does not provide a clear
indication of the priority area, which contributes to confusion.
The lack of clear, unambiguous markings makes it difficult for
drivers to understand the priority zone and their obligations.
Legal Distinction Between 'Give Way' and 'Give Priority':
According to the Traffic Signs Regulations and General
Directions (TSRGD) 2016, 'Give Way' and 'Give Priority To' are
distinct traffic control measures. A 'Give Way' sign (Regulation
10 of the TSRGD) requires a driver to yield and stop if
necessary, whereas a 'Give Priority To' sign (Regulation 16)
requires drivers to allow other vehicles to proceed in
situations where they have priority, but it does not require a
complete stop unless necessary. The addition of a 'Give Way'
line does not change the nature of a 'Give Priority To' sign or
its requirements.
Distance and Positioning of Vehicles: The CCTV images do not
accurately reflect the distance from the bridge to the traffic
island beyond it. The stretch of road is much longer than
depicted in the images. The 'Priority over oncoming vehicles'
sign is positioned just before the bridge on the other side, not
immediately after it. In the CCTV footage, the oncoming vehicle
is only at the traffic island, before the speed sign and well
before the traffic calming humps. Diagram 615 (Item 9 in Part 2
of Schedule 3 to the TSRGD 2016) indicates that priority must be
given to vehicles from the opposite direction, but this
requirement is not limitless. The presence of another vehicle
further down the road does not automatically necessitate waiting
if the vehicle is not within the immediate priority area.
In light of these points, I respectfully request that the
tribunal review the PCN in light of the evidence provided and
the considerations outlined above. I believe that a fair
assessment will conclude that no contravention occurred.
Thank you for your attention to this matter. I am available to
provide any further information or clarification if required and
look forward to your decision.
Yours sincerely,
[Your Name]
[Your Address]
[Your Contact Information]
[Vehicle Registration Number]
#Post#: 34350--------------------------------------------------
Re: SALTER HILL - LAMBETH Help PCN Tribunal
DIR By: terminator x
Date: August 23, 2024, 10:47 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I'm just here to say is this what the world has now come to,
LA's zooming in on number plates from a distance for minor
traffic offences. Insane!
TX.
#Post#: 34357--------------------------------------------------
Re: SALTER HILL - LAMBETH Help PCN Tribunal
DIR By: niknakpop
Date: August 23, 2024, 11:01 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=terminator x link=topic=2861.msg34350#msg34350
date=1724428055]
I'm just here to say is this what the world has now come to,
LA's zooming in on number plates from a distance for minor
traffic offences. Insane!
TX.
[Haha, I think lambeth must be going through financial hardship
clearly]
#Post#: 34370--------------------------------------------------
Re: SALTER HILL - LAMBETH Help PCN Tribunal
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: August 23, 2024, 11:37 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Why have you referred to the sign as 'Give Way' in your para
'Positioning of vehicle??
Why have you wrongly referred to the meaning of a 'Give Way'
sign? These are ONLY used at road junctions.
Have you registered your appeal?
If not, I refer to my post on 20 Aug!
#Post#: 34381--------------------------------------------------
Re: SALTER HILL - LAMBETH Help PCN Tribunal
DIR By: niknakpop
Date: August 23, 2024, 12:15 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Thank you, i have now changed this, i have until the 19th
September to submit further information re my appeal.
*****************************************************
Page 2 of 2
DIR Previous Page