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#Post#: 33375--------------------------------------------------
Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: Vizard
Date: August 14, 2024, 1:19 pm
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We paid to park in the green car park, but Mrs Vizard directed
me the wrong turn-off from the roundabout and we headed towards
drop-off. Once on that road it was one way, the earlier wider
part had a coach on it. So we could not turn round and had to
drive past drop off to the exit barrier.
At the barrier there was no response from the help button. We
had no means of payment in the car, because we didn't expect to
pay for anything until we were in the terminal. I also felt that
paying would signal agreement that we were prepared to pay.
After five minutes of trying the help button I could see no
airport staff to speak to, so I tailgated another car out of the
adjacent barrier.
A fine has been issued. I appealed stating the above and
received a response completely ignoring what I has said. It said
that by entering the drop-off lane we'd accepted the T&Cs and
must pay. They also said that the fact I could exit via a
barrier means the call button was working on the adjacent
exit.... err okay.
I can evidence that we had paid in advance for the green car
park. Their CCTV will show that we didn't stop or use the
drop-off.
I cannot appeal again, it is POPLA or wait for litigation.
Is POPLA worth a shot? A quick Google suggests they tend to
favour the parking companies.
#Post#: 33417--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: b789
Date: August 15, 2024, 2:32 am
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If the driver has been identified, then you have, figuratively
speaking, shot both feet off. You only had to appeal as the
keeper. There is no obligation for the keeper to identify the
driver to an unregulated private parking company.
No “fine” has been issued. It is simply a speculative invoice
from an unregulated private parking company for an alleged
breach of contract by the driver. Had you appealed as the keeper
and not identified the driver, if the operator had not cancelled
the PCN then POPLA certainly would have.
As the driver has been identified, that ship has, unfortunately,
sailed.
POPLA will only consider points of law and the BPA or the Joint
BPA/IPC Code of Practice (CoP). They do not take mitigation into
account.
I suggest you go through the CoP and find points to use in your
POPLA appeal.
Joint BPA/IPC Code of Practice
HTML https://www.britishparking.co.uk/write/Documents/AOS/NEW%20Redesigned%20Documents/sectorsingleCodeofPracticeVersion1260624.pdf
#Post#: 33419--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: Vizard
Date: August 15, 2024, 3:30 am
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The driver has not been identified, however they can (and do)
pursue the RK.
But thank you I will take a look.
#Post#: 33422--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: b789
Date: August 15, 2024, 4:08 am
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As long as the driver has not been identified, inadvertently or
otherwise, then this can be easily won at POPLA on the basis
that the PCN has been issued incorrectly.
The location is not relevant land for the purposes of PoFA as it
is under statutory control. Only the driver can be liable. The
keeper is known. The driver is unknown (unless identified by the
known keeper).
The known keeper is under no legal obligation to identify the
unknown driver to an unregulated private parking company. No
inference or assumptions can be made that the known keeper must
also have been the unknown driver and that is supported by
persuasive case law.
You have to lead the POPLA assessor down this reasoning. Assume
they have no idea about the ability to hold a known keeper
liable for the actions of the unknown driver unless all the
requirements of PoFA have been complied with. Point out that
PoFA cannot apply at the location because it is an airport
covered by bylaws which means that it is under statutory
control.
Because of all that, only the unknown driver can be liable for
the charge and the burden of proof is on the operator to show
that the person they are pursuing is the driver. They can't.
#Post#: 33425--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: Vizard
Date: August 15, 2024, 4:44 am
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I hear you and that was my understanding, but I lost a court
case as the RK. I seem to recall the T&Cs stated that the RK was
ultimately liable. It was a while ago, though.
#Post#: 33430--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: b789
Date: August 15, 2024, 5:05 am
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The RK can ONLY be "ultimately" liable if the charge was issued
with full compliance with all the requirements of PoFA. In this
case, PoFA cannot apply as the location is land under statutory
control.
It matters not what the Ts&Cs say. Liability for the contract
agreed by conduct is what counts.
So, unless the RK identified as the driver, they cannot be
liable. Your "understanding" is flawed, which is why I intimated
at the start of this thread, if you, the RK, have in any way
identified as the driver, inadvertently or otherwise, such as
using terminology in your initial appeal such as "I parked..."
instead of "The driver parked...", then you have identified as
the driver.
#Post#: 33432--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: Vizard
Date: August 15, 2024, 5:09 am
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OK noted thank you.
#Post#: 33462--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: Dave65
Date: August 15, 2024, 10:08 am
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This is an extract from a posting last year.
The links will not work as it was from pepipoo.
Standsted Airport by Redx June 8th 2023
Must have been 11 years ago, it all changed back in 2012 when
POFA 2012 came into being in October 2012.!! So more than a
decade ago now
If its land within the airport boundary then Bylaws apply
meaning that POFA 2012 schedule 4 cannot apply, so they appear
to have misread and misquoted pofa liability, misleading the
keeper
Appeal as keeper if the vehicle is private and not hired or
leased, using a similar appeal to the Nosy Parker ones at other
airports
If it is not relevant land, then to me it's also a breach of the
BPA CoP version 8, misrepresentation on Bylaws controlled land,
in which case report them to the BPA AOS compliance team online
on the BPA website, citing the breach of the CoP, quoting any
relevant numbered paragraphs etc, like was recommended by coupon
mad in this thread
HTML https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discus...tansted-airport
And read this plus the link by Umkomaas too
HTML http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=147067
HTML https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discus...anstead-airport
Do not reveal or infer who was driving, it's known only by you,
keep it that way and edit your posts above
The driver drove on the day
The keeper is dealing with the postal pcn, as keeper
This post has been edited by Redx: Thu, 8 Jun 2023 - 21:48
#Post#: 33479--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stansted airport drop off. POPLA worth a go?
DIR By: Vizard
Date: August 15, 2024, 12:23 pm
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Thanks Dave
I cannot see how to edit the post. But there must have been
multiple cars doing the same over the past few months, because
the express set down is a a trap.
Once you are on the road heading towards it you cannot stop,
turn around or escape. You are, I suspect they argue, committing
to a contract. But it is one that you do not intend to enter
into willingly and from which you cannot escape.
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