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#Post#: 30662--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: The Rookie
Date: July 22, 2024, 4:34 am
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No point saying who the driver is, they aren’t involved at all
now.
HOWEVER if the keeper (the person named on the claim form)
wasn’t driving then it’s critical to determine if the keeper can
be liable at all (which needs the NTK, the first document sent
to the keeper), if they failed to meet the requirements then the
defendant shouldn’t not be found liable at all.
While you ignored, you did at least hopefully keep the documents
alleging a debt? And yes ignoring is bad advice, especially if
it means then ignoring the formal letter before claim.
#Post#: 30663--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: b789
Date: July 22, 2024, 4:34 am
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There is no need to identify the driver. As above, In whose name
is the claim? That is the person that will be responding. If it
is in your wife's name but you want to do all the work, that is
OK but it has to be in her name.
I forgot to add to the bottom of the suggested defence the
Statement of Truth which should be as follows:
I believe that the facts stated in this Defence are true. I
understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought
against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false
statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without
an honest belief in its truth.
So the defence you will be sending should look like this with
the appropriate bits filled in:
[indent]
---------------------------------------------------------
[center]IN THE COUNTY COURT[/center]
[right]Claim No: [Claim Number][/right]
[center]BETWEEN:
[Claimant's Full Name]
Claimant
- and -
[Defendant's Full Name]
Defendant
---------------------------------------------------------
DEFENCE
[/center]
1. The Defendant denies any liability for this claim.
2. There is a lack of precise detail in the Particulars of Claim
(PoC) in respect of the factual and legal allegations made
against the Defendant such that the PoC do not comply with CPR
16.4(1)(a).
3. The Defendant is unable to plead properly to the PoC because:
(i) The contract referred to is not attached to the PoC in
accordance with CPR PD 16.7.3;
(ii) The PoC do not state the exact wording of the clause (or
clauses) of the terms and conditions of the contract (or
contracts) which is/are relied on;
(iii) The PoC do not set out the reason (or reasons) why the
claimant asserts the defendant has breached the contract (or
contracts);
(iv) The PoC do not state with sufficient particularity
exactly where the breach occurred, the exact time when the
breach occurred and how long it is alleged that the vehicle was
parked before the parking charge was allegedly incurred;
(v) The PoC do not state exactly how the claim for statutory
interest is calculated.
(vi) The PoC do not state what proportion of the claim is the
parking charge and what proportion is damages.
(vii) The PoC states that the Claimant is suing the defendant
as the driver or the keeper. The claimant obviously knows
whether the defendant is being sued as the driver or the keeper
and should not be permitted to plead alternative causes of
action.
4. The Defendant has attached to this defence a copy of an order
made at another court which the allocating judge ought to make
at this stage so that the Defendant can then know and understand
the case which he/she/it faces and can then respond properly to
the claim.
I believe that the facts stated in this Defence are true. I
understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought
against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false
statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without
an honest belief in its truth.
Signed:
Date:[/indent]
And then the draft order:
[indent]Before District Judge [Name] on [Date]
Of the Court's own initiative and upon reading the particulars
of claim and the defence
AND the court being of the view that there is a lack of precise
detail in the particulars of claim in respect of the factual and
legal allegations made against the defendant such that the
particulars of claim do not comply with CPR 16.4(1)(a)
Order
1. Unless the Claimant do by 4pm on (insert a date here 14 days
from typing the order) file at court a further particulars of
claim which complies with CPR 16.4(1)(a) and which sets out:
(i) the precise and concise factual allegations it makes against
the Defendant and
(ii) the factual or legal [or both] basis of its claim and
(iii) exactly how its claim is calculated (if there is a claim
for a fixed sum)
then the claim shall be struck out.
1. For the avoidance of doubt the further particulars of
claim must refer to and have attached to them the contract (or
contracts) between the claimant and defendant relied on [marked
"A"] and must set out the exact wording of the clause (or
clauses) of the terms and conditions of the contract (or
contracts) which is/are relied on.
2. For the avoidance of doubt the further particulars of
claim must, in respect of each and every alleged breach of
contract, set out the reason (or reasons) why the claimant
asserts that the defendant was in breach of contract.
3. For the avoidance of doubt the further particulars of
claim must, in respect of each and every alleged breach of
contract, set out the full postal address of where the breach
took place, the precise date and time of the alleged breach, and
exactly how long it is alleged that the defendant had parked
his/her/its/their vehicle before the parking charge was incurred
4. For the avoidance of doubt the further particulars of
claim must set out a precise calculation of any claim for
statutory interest up to the date of issue to include the date
when it is said that interest started running.
5. Permission to either party to apply to set aside, vary or
stay this order by an application on notice which must be filed
at this Court not more than 5 days after service of this order,
failing which no such application may be made.[/indent]
The defence statement can be signed electronically by simply
typing the full name of the defendant where it says "signature".
#Post#: 32664--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: Jag84
Date: August 8, 2024, 6:17 am
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Apologies if this is a stupid question. For the "Draft Order"
,template below, I put my wifes name who is the owner of the
car and the claim against ?
"And then the draft order:
Before District Judge [Name] on [08-Aug-2024]"
#Post#: 32666--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: b789
Date: August 8, 2024, 6:22 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Only the person named on the claim can respond. There is only
the driver and the keeper. There is nothing to show who is the
"owner" and if you look at the front of the V5C, it specifically
states that it is not proof of ownership. In whose name is the
claim?
There has been a slight amendment to the Draft Order which you
should use as it does not require any editing.
If you haven't sent the defence yet, there are also some minor
changes, in which case use the latest version which is linked
below:
Short defence third person
HTML https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/e3ywca2o8vkrqxpy6bddn/Short-defence.pdf?rlkey=x1fukkeyi1w58l6x2axezmwid&dl=0
Draft order for the short defence
HTML https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/z8zcqfdncdoajgj4ag6a4/short-defence-orderP1.pages.pdf?rlkey=at98xmfwj0ehi3w9d0ia15ogp&dl=0
#Post#: 32667--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: DWMB2
Date: August 8, 2024, 6:24 am
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--- Quote from: b789 link ---
>
> If you haven't sent the defence yet, there are also some minor
changes, in which case use the latest version which is linked
below:
>
> Short defence third person
HTML https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/e3ywca2o8vkrqxpy6bddn/Short-defence.pdf?rlkey=x1fukkeyi1w58l6x2axezmwid&dl=0
>
> Draft order for the short defence
HTML https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/e3ywca2o8vkrqxpy6bddn/Short-defence.pdf?rlkey=x1fukkeyi1w58l6x2axezmwid&dl=0
>
--- End Quote ---
Both of those links lead to the same document.
#Post#: 32668--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: b789
Date: August 8, 2024, 6:26 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: DWMB2 link ---
>
> Both of those links lead to the same document.
>
--- End Quote ---
fixed
#Post#: 32683--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: Jag84
Date: August 8, 2024, 7:03 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Ok for this new draft order template I don't need to fill
anything out can just attach as is ?
HTML https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/z8zcqfdncdoajgj4ag6a4/short-defence-orderP1.pages.pdf?rlkey=at98xmfwj0ehi3w9d0ia15ogp&e=1&dl=0
#Post#: 32684--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: b789
Date: August 8, 2024, 7:12 am
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Yes, just attach it. You only need to change the
claimant/defendant names, claim number ad type signature and
date in the defence.
#Post#: 32709--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: Jag84
Date: August 8, 2024, 10:23 am
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Are there any instructions on how to do the Defence on "Money
Claim" ?
I've pasted the contents of the "Defence" template under the
"Defence Particulars" section and I assume this is where I
should also attach the "Defence Order" ? However I can't find
anything that allows me to attach a document in this section or
the subsequent sections that follow
Should I just paste the "Defence Order" in "Defence Particulars"
section under my Defence text ?
I've also said I'm not making a counterclaim I assume that is
correct ?
#Post#: 32711--------------------------------------------------
Re: I've followed the wrong advice anyway out ?
DIR By: DWMB2
Date: August 8, 2024, 10:30 am
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--- Quote from: b789 link ---
>
> DO NOT file your defence using the MCOL website. Your defence
will be submitted as a PDF attachment to an email.
>
--- End Quote ---
As per the previous advice, do not submit using MCOL. Send it
via email. The relevant addresses are here: New email addresses
for CNBC (AoS/Defence/DQ and more)
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/private-parking-tickets/new-email-addresses-for-cnbc-(aosdefencedq-and-more)/
Using the MCOL system for the defence ruins the formatting, and
doesn't allow attachments.
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