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#Post#: 29514--------------------------------------------------
Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: mmd
Date: July 11, 2024, 11:14 am
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My partner (who is insured on my car) took the vehicle onto
Stanmore Broadway (HA7) and has incurred a fine by going into an
area which was no entry. As a regular visitor to this area, I
enquired how this happened and she mentioned that there are two
very similar looking points on Stanmore Broadway - one motorist
can enter and another that has a no entry. Crying baby in tow,
she made this mistake after my daughter had just vomited (on a
hot summer's day). Given, this PCN was issued in my name, I
appealed on the basis that the car was taken without my consent,
which the council reject as 'unless the vehicle was reported as
stolen' they will not transfer liability.
Is there any recourse here?
#Post#: 29517--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: PallasAthena
Date: July 11, 2024, 11:40 am
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Are you willing to report your partner to the police for having
taken your car without your consent, an offence under section 12
of the Theft Act 1968? Putting your partner in the frame for an
offence that, theoretically at least, is an imprisonable offence
in order to avoid a PCN seems like a bad idea to me.
Had you specifically told her she was not permitted to drive
your car that day? Even though she had your child in the car and
is insured to drive it? Is the car regularly used by both of you
as a family car? If you have put her on the insurance you would
struggle to convince the police or anyone else that she didn't
have your permission to drive it. And she would need to confirn
that she had actual knowledge that she drove without your
consent for the TWOC offence to be proved. Will she do that, and
lay herself open to prosecution?
There may be ways to avoid this but claiming your partner had
taken your car without your consent (in effect, "stolen" it)
doesn't seem to me to be the best route. I assume you are not
wanting to destroy your relationship.
#Post#: 29518--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: 666
Date: July 11, 2024, 11:43 am
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Was the car really taken without your consent? If so, why did
you not report it?
Do you really want to turn a very minor non-criminal matter into
a criminal charge for one or both of you?
What are you trying to achieve by "transferring liability?"
#Post#: 29519--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: mickR
Date: July 11, 2024, 11:45 am
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I thought there was an argument for TWOC that didn't constitute
theft
#Post#: 29521--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: Southpaw82
Date: July 11, 2024, 11:53 am
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--- Quote from: mickR link ---
>
> I thought there was an argument for TWOC that didn't
constitute theft
>
--- End Quote ---
TWOC was brought in specifically because theft was often not an
appropriate charge. Do you perhaps mean that the definition of
TWOC is different to “the vehicle was taken without my consent”,
or that the TWOC-er might have a defence to the criminal charge?
Nevertheless, the assertion that the vehicle was taken without
consent seems contrived.
#Post#: 29523--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: mmd
Date: July 11, 2024, 11:59 am
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100% contrived. Given, I haven't much experience in this domain,
I thought TWOC would easily exonerate me. In any case, it seems
unfair that this PCN is on me when I wasn't the driver.
#Post#: 29525--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: mickR
Date: July 11, 2024, 12:01 pm
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@SP very possibly what I was thinking of. I remember someone
coming up with another argument for two. maybe I was
misunderstanding what they were getting at.
the suggestion that in this case it's bolox contrived hasn't
escaped me ;)
#Post#: 29531--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: Boomer
Date: July 11, 2024, 12:58 pm
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mmd,
howz about posting a copy of the PCN (with personal details
removed) so that we can see _exactly_ what you have been accused
of?
Also your response, and the council's rejection letter.
#Post#: 29536--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: mickR
Date: July 11, 2024, 1:23 pm
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^ this
#Post#: 29598--------------------------------------------------
Re: Vehicle taken without Consent
DIR By: mmd
Date: July 12, 2024, 4:20 am
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I do not have a copy of the initial PCN notification from the
Council.
Here's what is presented online:
Contravention: Failing To Comply With A No Entry Restriction
Date: 2024-06-0202 Jun, 2024
Time: 16:27
Location: THE BROADWAY (NEAR SIDE OF No 66)
Charge outstanding: £65
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