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#Post#: 1670--------------------------------------------------
Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Badge
DIR By: drobmet
Date: July 20, 2023, 7:59 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi Everyone,
I have been kindly advised to re post here having already posted
this topic in another forum. Hopefully I can get some advice on
the matter. For reference, here is the old post:
HTML http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=149694
I received a PCN in somewhat peculiar circumstances. My partner
is disabled, and we have a valid disabled badge for our car.
We were passing through the croydon area, when my partner
desperately required the bathroom due to one of her
debilitations. Knowing there was a shopping centre nearby, i
found a street close, and approaching where I parked, looked up
in a rush and saw only the one way sign on the lamp post. I
parked at the first opportunity where there was no one else
parked.
I displayed the badge correctly, and we moved quickly for the
centre walking away from the car from the passenger side. Across
the street walking by was a CEO. Passing by in a hurry, I asked
if it was ok to park where I had as my partner desperately
needed the bathroom and was disabled. He said, I quote, 'That’ll
be fine, it’s on a single yellow, no worries.’ Feeling
reassured, we hurried for the centre.
We returned to the car from the passenger side. After letting my
partner in, I opened the driver side door, and saw a yellow PCN
envelope on the ground between my car and the lamp post. The
envelope appeared a little mangled, and had half of it stuck to
itself. I opened it out of curiosity, to reveal it was indeed
for my car. Confused, I stepped out, and It was then I looked at
the post and spotted the No Loading sign.
Sadly, I had made an error, and missed the clear blips on the
road due to the situation I was in and not seeing them as other
cars were parked right behind where I stopped.
Here is the original PCN:
PCN Front -
HTML https://ibb.co/x3hQ4qs
PCN Back -
HTML https://ibb.co/5MssCjh
My Photo -
HTML https://ibb.co/brsZkc1
Since then, I made the following representation within the
discounted period:
------
I parked my vehicle on 19th April 2023 at Firth Road whilst I
urgently assisted my disabled passenger.
We were passing through the Croydon area, and unfortunately due
to her disabilities and IBS, she suddenly desperately required
the bathroom. I stopped at the earliest opportunity in order to
try and find a public restroom.
Due to the time sensitive nature of the situation, as I entered
Firth Road, I saw it was a single yellow line throughout, and
the earliest opportunity to stop was where I parked.
I hurriedly displayed our disabled badge, and rushing out of the
car, we encountered a CEO on the street opposite. I quickly
pointed out my car and asked if where I was parked was alright
as my partner needed a restroom urgently due to her
disabilities. He responded, 'That’ll be fine, it’s on a single
yellow, no worries.’
Upon returning to my vehicle approximately 30 minutes later
having attended to my Partner and ensured her safety and
comfort, I was horrified to discover that a PCN had been
attached to my windscreen. We were very confused having been
advised by an on duty CEO it would be ok.
I enclose a copy of both the front and back of the Blue badge,
together with my passenger’s disability documentation for
reference.
There was no intent or purpose to evade any parking restriction.
I sincerely apologise for this occurrence but it is one which is
unfortunate and unforeseen.
I would therefore kindly request your discretion, given the
circumstances, in cancelling this PCN.
Thank you and kind regards
------
And subsequently received the following response:
Page 1:
HTML https://ibb.co/Vg15xVS
Page2:
HTML https://ibb.co/njCnfc1
Page 3:
HTML https://ibb.co/Zz4pZxK
Page 4:
HTML https://ibb.co/RT0vXVv
Choosing to take others advice, I decided to indeed wait for the
NTO and try and fight our corner to see if anything could be
done.
------
It has been a while, and in typical fashion, today I received
the NTO much later than anticipated. So late, in fact, I have
but 2 days, if I’m counting correctly, to put together a
representation. Here are the 3 pages received:
Page 1
HTML https://ibb.co/X8jzRw7
Page2
HTML https://ibb.co/VQnGHLP
Page 3
HTML https://ibb.co/RyVxz38
I have read the NTO carefully, and can’t see any procedural
impropriety, however I am not as well versed as many of you are,
so I may have missed something.
I suppose my questions now, given the limited time I have to
respond online, are:
1. Are there any procedural improprieties anyone has spotted
that I have missed?
2. Is there a way to ask for any additional time to form a
representation, given the delay in the post of the NTO?
3. Should I simply copy and paste my previous representation?
4. If not, would anyone have any advice as to what to include
and the best way to form it for the new representation?
[member=1]cp8759[/member] Thank you for your post elsewhere, I
have read the Carl Peters v Cheshire West and Chester Council
result. It is encouraging, although there, the driver themselves
were in trouble, rather than a passenger the driver may have
been attempting to assist. Is there any way you can imagine my
referencing this case, so I could perhaps utilise it in my
representation?
Thanks again to everyone for their time and knowledge in
advance, it’s greatly appreciated!
#Post#: 1676--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 21, 2023, 3:32 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Can you give us some details about any medical condition your
mother has that might amount to mitigation?
I had a blue badge appeal the other day and the adjudicator was
quite interested in hearing about that, even if only to invite
the council to re-consider the question of mitigation.
Incidentally, do you still have the yellow envelope?
#Post#: 1692--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: Pastmybest
Date: July 21, 2023, 5:09 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I diagnosed medical condition that can lead to an unexpected
urgent need to use a toilet woyld be consideredd as beyond your
control(an exemption) also from your narritive there is an
argument that service has not been properly effected but we need
to see all the council photos You have until the 25th to submit
representations so act quickly to show us the photos and give an
indication of the medical condition then we can help draft a
representation
#Post#: 1697--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 21, 2023, 6:10 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Council photos might support the view that the envelope was not
properly attached:
HTML https://i.imgur.com/P1HI8AZ.jpg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/T3uGNHt.jpg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/6LeTyfW.jpg
HTML https://i.imgur.com/LkNif24.jpg
We've got an appeal being run at the moment on this point, but
the OP had the foresight to keep the envelope with the removable
strip that covers the adhesive still attached, so this can be
produced to the adjudicator.
Also the CEO can be seen reflected in the last image and based
on that image, I'd suggest we put them to proof as to whether he
was wearing a compliant uniform.
#Post#: 1719--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: lexy
Date: July 21, 2023, 12:38 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
The problem is, the PCN was correctly issued on the surface.
Blue badges can be used on ordinary yellow lines, but not where
there are stripes up the kerb.
You're going to have to go hard for the emergency/disability
thing - it's all you've got here. There's also an argument for
'assisted boarding and alighting' if she needed help to get
in/out of the car and to the facilities. That's allowed in
places that have stripes up the kerb.
#Post#: 1724--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: guest179
Date: July 21, 2023, 3:30 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Whether assisted alighting or circumstances beyond your control,
IMO you'll have to say more than 'Upon returning to my vehicle
approximately 30 minutes later'.
#Post#: 1738--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 21, 2023, 7:01 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
One key point is that the mitigation put forward needs to be
compelling.
#Post#: 1746--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: drobmet
Date: July 21, 2023, 8:00 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Apologies all for my late response, it has been a trying day.
[member=1]cp8759[/member] Not sure if relevant. But it was my
partner rather than Mother. Because I am her daily carer, her
disabled badge is registered to my car.
The two conditions relevant to this case would be her IBS and
Fibromyalgia ( a chronic pain condition ). Fibro affects her on
a daily basis to varying degrees, but she receives benefits due
to her debilitations being severe enough she needs my care and
assistance every day.
The two can interplay in a very sudden and painful way and is
what necessitated the stop, the pain was just too much to manage
or control her IBS.
I do actually still have the envelope. Ive kept it flat on its
original backing. It seems the top strip was taken off, but half
of it attached to itself. The main backing remained, though has
dried somewhat by now. It was next to my car on the ground close
to my front wheel when I found it. The photo of it on my car
shows it wasn’t exactly neatly applied to the window. Shall I
post photos off what remains?
Not sure how to approach the uniform perhaps not being
compliant, but adding it as a point of contention couldn’t hurt?
[member=156]Pastmybest[/member] She is diagnosed with both IBS
and Fibromyalgia, which is what was at play here, and required
the quick stop.
[member=281]lexy[/member] Yes, it was certainly my oversight not
looking for the blips or checking for the no loading sign behind
the one way sign. I allowed the situation to overwhelm me, and
focused on my partner rather than where I was parking.
She does rely on me for ‘assisted boarding and alighting’ more
often than not.
A walking stick is always present in the car as her Fibromyalgia
at it’s worst will require her to use a wheelchair or a mobility
scooter ( her condition is variable, but walking stick used
daily ) and in this scenario, I was supporting her, walking /
stumbling as quickly as possible arm in arm. The CEO we passed
certainly saw this, and I believe realising she was disabled and
having trouble, advised as they did seemingly in error.
[member=179]Ugly duckling[/member] The reason for the length of
time was due to her struggling to get to the bathroom followed
by my required assistance. We went as quickly as we could. How
would you suggest I communicate this more effectively than I
already have?
Thanks all for your quick responses and advice, I truly
appreciate it and look forward to hopefully reading more later (
I’ll try interact during the day if I can )
#Post#: 1755--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: Pastmybest
Date: July 22, 2023, 4:59 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Ok without being disrespectful to others You are not asking for
mitigation but claiming a legal exemption of stopped for reasons
beyond your control and or a medical emergency. The BB is an
irrelevance so do not even mention it.
Draft a challenge and post it here and se will tidy it up for
you. Start with the medical conditions creating an overwhelming
need for the toilet explain the pain that is caused, also point
out that you are the carer to your and that you had to
accompany them. Then make the point that the PCN was not on
your car but on the floor next to it point out the backing had
not been removed and that the PCN was not in the envelope just
stuck to a part of the adhesive strip. As for the uniform point
out that you spoke to a CEO and checked that you would be OK
where you were parked and they said yes, then ask for
confirmation that the CEO was authorised and in the correct
uniform that would allow them to issue a PCN
#Post#: 1822--------------------------------------------------
Re: Croydon Code 02 Parked or Loading/Unloading in a restricted
street, Frith Road, Stopped due to disabilities with Bad
DIR By: drobmet
Date: July 23, 2023, 6:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi Everyone,
Apologies for not attending to this sooner, there has been a
family emergency that I needed to attend to and has overwhelmed
me.
I hereby include my draft representation. I’m not sure how much
time I’ll have tomorrow to make major edits, so if anyone could
assist, I would be greatly appreciative!
——-
Dear Sirs,
On the 19th April 2023, whilst driving in the Croydon area, my
disabled passenger experienced an overwhelming pain requiring
her to use the bathroom. As she is a diagnosed sufferer of IBS,
Chronic Fatigue and Fibromyalgia, this abdominal pain can be
excruciating and all encompassing, preventing her from being
able to walk properly, even when aided. It is something that
needs addressing as soon as it occurs as it can lead to
sustained pain and extreme chronic fatigue in the subsequent
days, requiring lots of recovery.
As her personal carer, and driver of the vehicle, I parked at
the first available opportunity on Firth Road in order to search
for a public restroom and urgently accompany my passenger for
something that was out of my control and a medical emergency.
Due to her needing assistance with both boarding and alighting,
i hurriedly displayed the disabled badge and attended to her.
Rushing out of the car, we encountered a CEO on the street
opposite. I quickly pointed out my car and asked if where I was
parked was alright as my partner needed a restroom urgently due
to her disabilities. He responded, 'That’ll be fine, it’s on a
single yellow, no worries.’
Upon returning to my vehicle having attended to my Partner and
ensured her safety and comfort, I was horrified to discover that
a PCN envelope had been attached to my windscreen. We were very
confused having been advised by an on duty CEO it would be ok.
Upon closer inspection, the envelope had not had its backing
removed, and was loose and empty. The PCN I later found next to
the front wheel of my car on the ground.
Based on the photos provided as part of my PCN, I see the
reflection of someone who had seemingly attached the PCN. I
would like to confirm whether the CEO was authorised and in the
correct uniform that would allow them to issue a PCN.
I enclose a copy of both the front and back of the Blue badge
issued to my passenger, together with my passenger’s disability
documentation for reference, and photos of the PCN and its
envelope.
There was no intent or purpose to evade any parking restriction.
I sincerely apologise for this occurrence outside of my control
but it is one which is unfortunate and unforeseen.
I would therefore kindly request an exemption given the
circumstances and evidence provided, and ask that this PCN be
cancelled.
Thank you and kind regards
——-
[member=156]Pastmybest[/member] Just to confirm, my original
representation stated the PcN was attached to my windshield as I
was advised before not to bother with saying it was on the
ground. I have therefore reworked the story as if I am adding
more detail. Please advise whether I should stick to this, or
write something else. My actually experience was the entirety of
the envelope and loosely attached PCN were on the ground.
Also, should I be sending photos of / mentioning the PCN and
envelope with backing now? Or leave it for the moment?
I don’t want to go into all the gruesome details, so hopefully
this is enough for my representation. I will endeavour to check
the forum in the morning to make adjustments throughout the day
if I can and get this sent online by the evening.
Thanks all, and I hope for further help if required.
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