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#Post#: 1671--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: justice4driversnow10
Date: July 21, 2023, 1:56 am
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Thanks, I will try and get some in next day or so.
#Post#: 1717--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: lexy
Date: July 21, 2023, 12:16 pm
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Advance warning sign
HTML https://goo.gl/maps/yJMBPE2nMEHehvL49
Signs at the start of the bus gate
HTML https://goo.gl/maps/hyYD3nBA1yfEb5VB7
#Post#: 1734--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 21, 2023, 6:31 pm
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--- Quote from: lexy link ---
>
> Advance warning sign
HTML https://goo.gl/maps/yJMBPE2nMEHehvL49
>
> Signs at the start of the bus gate
HTML https://goo.gl/maps/hyYD3nBA1yfEb5VB7
>
--- End Quote ---
Let's home the OP's photos reveal a change in circumstances.
#Post#: 1756--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: justice4driversnow10
Date: July 22, 2023, 5:16 am
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Thanks All, will aim to get these pictures today or tomorrow.
#Post#: 1781--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: justice4driversnow10
Date: July 22, 2023, 3:38 pm
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Hi All,
So I went back to road this afternoon on foot and took some
pictures and video of the advance sign and the sign on the entry
to the bus gate (Video and pictures located here:
HTML https://www.flickr.com/photos/198760434@N04/with/53064145104/
Have to say they match what is on google maps. I did miss the
advance sign as there was 1 large van in front of me as I was
passing it by and was glancing at my Sat Nav at the time. What I
see in the video is that there are couple of posts with other
signs partially obscuring the advance bus gate sign so not sure
if that could be highlighted. I did then notice in the video
that I recorded today, that there is a diversion and road ahead
closed sign at the traffic lights before the bus gate entrance.
These signs weren't there on the 10th July 2023 the date of the
alleged contravention.
If you refer to video footage I have provided in the link above,
1 minute and 40 seconds in you will see 2 vehicles trying to
turn back and on this occasion succeeding and thus not entering
the bus gate. I was trying to do the same but the car behind was
too close and refused to go back. Had it done the same as the 2
vehicles in the video I have provided, I too would have been
able to turn back and avoided entering the bus gate thus not in
contravention of the restriction. It is very frustrating. I
still feel I should appeal on the 'Other Grounds' and looking at
this link from this website:
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xnmj-f7F-2vJBWxrX7r2XWkb9GPOR0fj/view<br
/>from the cancellation guide from Manchester City Council, I
feel
my case falls into the text below:
"Other Reasonable Grounds/Mitigating Circumstances
On occasions where the PCN was correctly issued, but there are
mitigating
circumstances, the Council will take into consideration
mitigation when
reaching a decision.
The Council has a duty to act fairly and proportionately and
will exercise
discretion sensibly and reasonably.
We will also consider using our discretion to cancel a PCN in
the following
circumstances:
● Where there is satisfactory evidence that the vehicle
had broken down
and reasonable steps were taken to remove it as soon as possible
(evidence must be supplied)
● Where the interests of justice in the Council’s opinion
require the
cancellation of the PCN."
Does anyone agree? If anyone could offer me a statement to that
effect that I can put forward in my representation / appeal I
would be really grateful. Happy for you to DM if you can also.
Have to re-iterate pedestrian and motorist safety was what I
took into consideration in terms of not reversing. There was an
opportunity prior to the car behind where I could have reversed
but that is when many pedestrians where crossing directly behind
that would have been dangerous and more serious than then
contravening the restriction. So I believe some discretion needs
to be taken into account and I feel justice here would be to
cancel the PCN as I had no other choice. Anyone agree?
#Post#: 1805--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: justice4driversnow10
Date: July 23, 2023, 11:50 am
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Hi All,
Any feedback on how I should proceed?
Thanks
#Post#: 1872--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 24, 2023, 1:06 pm
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Here is my suggestion (you'll have to remove the spaces from the
youtube URL, I had to add them as otherwise the forum video
integration was hiding the text):
[indent]
Dear Manchester City Council,
I challenge liability for PCN MC15861930 on the basis that the
alleged contravention did not occur. When I approached the bus
gate I saw the signs and attempted to reverse out, however the
driver behind my was blocking my path so I was effectively
trapped. The council has placed a traffic island at this
location such that it is not possible to take an alternative
route if drivers in close proximity to one's rear refuse to
reverse.
As an illustration of this scenario, I refer you to the video at
HTML https://www. youtube .com/watch?v=4KxRKgIx0hE which shows two
drivers executing exactly such a manoeuvre, but as that video
shows this is contingent on the driver at the rear being willing
to reverse.
I could not ram my way out nor could I reasonably be expected to
get out of the vehicle to start remontrating with the driver of
the car behind mine, as that could easily escalate into a road
rage incident.
In the circumstances, I was forced to proceed by circumstances
beyond my control and for that reason, the alleged contravention
did not occur.
Yours faithfully,
[/indent]
However before you send that, can you please confirm what else
you've sent to the council? This appears on the case history:
HTML https://i.imgur.com/Mo8VR7H.png
#Post#: 1874--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: justice4driversnow10
Date: July 24, 2023, 1:21 pm
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Thanks, really appreciate it. The two communications you can see
from me is my initial request to ask for the extended video
preceding what they have made available on the pcn and then a
follow up to ask for a status of the request. They have not
replied to either request. Am I OK to submit my challenge per
your advice?
#Post#: 1881--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: justice4driversnow10
Date: July 24, 2023, 1:48 pm
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The first response from me was replying indicating my intention
to appeal. The 2nd was when they provided me a link to the
viewmypcn site but only showing the footage which you saw. To
which I replied stating that I need 3 minutes of video footage
preceding what they have made available. The 3rd message from me
was to request a status update on the 2nd request. Not sure they
will reply and provide this footage that I have requested which
will show them the difference my situation and the situation I
posted over the weekend where the two drivers successfully
reversed back to avoid entering the bus gate.
#Post#: 1892--------------------------------------------------
Re: Manchester City Council - Alleged Bus Lane Contravention
PCN, Manchester Deansgate Bus Gate PCN received
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 24, 2023, 4:36 pm
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OK I just wanted to check you hadn't made a representation
already. In the circumstances, please send what I have drafted,
and please make sure to amend the youtube link so that they can
click on it.
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