DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
FreeTrafficLegalAdvice
HTML https://ftla.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so ...
*****************************************************
#Post#: 24826--------------------------------------------------
Is this sign confusing?
DIR By: Amsy
Date: June 3, 2024, 11:38 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi all, please can I have some adviCe for the PCN I received.
I had parked my car in a hurry and when I read the sign I
thought it said that no payment between 2-4, even the car in
front of me thought the same and just parked.
Anyway, it turns out that between 2-4 you can't pay and only
residents can park.
I wasn't the only one that thought the sign was confusing as
other people came out and also thought that they could park for
free during that time. There were literally 5 cars with tickets
on them.
Do I have a case for appeal, based on the sign being confusing
or shall I just pay it now?
I have attached a picture of the sign and also the PCN.
Any help and advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Amba
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 24831--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is this sign confusing?
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: June 3, 2024, 12:01 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I don't think it's confusing. Between the two sets of hours for
PbP parking, it is permits-only as per the permit holders times
Mon-Sat.
#Post#: 25249--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is this sign confusing?
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: June 7, 2024, 5:20 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
The sign is incorrect, in these circumstances the restrictions
should be split into distinct panels. Looking at this sign,
there is no clear indication that the first "or" is different to
the second "or", so you could read the sign and think you can't
fulfil either the first nor the second criteria, which leaves
you with "or Pay by phone" and think "alight, I'll do that".
[member=1914]Amsy[/member] please have a read of the guidance
here
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/,<br
/>post everything properly and I'll look at what other angles we
can find before drafting a representation for you.
#Post#: 25303--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is this sign confusing?
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: June 8, 2024, 11:27 am
---------------------------------------------------------
IMO, the sign is correct.
See Traffic Signs Manual, Chapter 3, 13.17.3:
'Where 2 types of parking occur at the same time they are shown
in a single panel separated by the word 'or'' ...as here.
Separate panels are reserved for:
Different activities e.g. loading and parking etc; and
The same activity but not overlapping but occurring
sequentially, which is therefore not a shared use bay.
The word 'or' occurs where required i.e. immediately after
'Permit holders' and has the effect of guiding the two types of
user to their part of the sign i.e. permit holders to the top
and non-permit holders parking to the lower part.
IMO, this sign is consistent with the TSM:
HTML https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/782724/traffic-signs-manual-chapter-03.pdf
*****************************************************
Page 1 of 1