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#Post#: 22083--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: b789
Date: May 10, 2024, 10:51 am
---------------------------------------------------------
You have explicitly agreed to Tesla paying and then charging
back to you in that agreement.
--- Quote ---
> You agree that Tesla pays any of these tickets or fines on
your behalf and passes on these costs including an additional
administrative fee of 20 EUR (+ VAT) or the equivalent in your
local currency to you at the exchange rate of the day the loaner
is returned. In cases of violations, you agree that Tesla
reserve the right to share your contact details with any
applicable local or national law enforcement
> agencies.
--- End Quote ---
However, that is a violation of the CRA 2015 section 62
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/section/62/enacted<br
/>in that it is an unfair term if they take away your right to
appeal the charge by just paying it without regard to your
rights. That failure means that that term is not binding on you,
the consumer.
Specifically CRA 62(4) "A term is unfair if, contrary to the
requirement of good faith, it causes a significant imbalance in
the parties’ rights and obligations under the contract to
the detriment of the consumer."
So, you could sue Tesla for the money they have taken from you.
This is quite easy to do through the county court (small claims)
using MCOL
HTML https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/web/mcol/welcome.
Whilst you may
still be liable for those parking charges (we know nothing about
how the driver became liable for them or who the PPC is), it is
highly likely that you, the hirer, would never have been liable
as 99.99% of all PPC issued NtHs are golden tickets which mean
they are 100% winnable along as the drivers identity is never
revealed.
All Tesla had to do was simply transfer liability to you, the
hirer, by informing the PPC that they, the registered keeper,
have hired to vehicle to you, the hirer. They didn't.
#Post#: 22085--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: DWMB2
Date: May 10, 2024, 11:01 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: b789 link ---
>
> So, you could sue Tesla for the money they have taken from
you.
>
--- End Quote ---
My understanding is that the money has not yet been taken from
him - they have simply invoiced him. The complication (at least
from a practical 'having access to a working car' point of view)
is that I understand from the previous posts that Tesla are
refusing to perform the agreed repair works until the OP settles
the demanded sums.
#Post#: 22087--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: b789
Date: May 10, 2024, 11:21 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I don't quite understand how this can be. Surely, the loaner car
was provided so that the owner could use it whilst their own car
was being repaired. How long was this loaner car provided for.
Surely the parking charges would have taken days if not up to 2
weeks to arrive at Tesla.
Are Tesla trying to hold the owner to ransom by telling them
that they will not begin to do the repairs (are they warranty
repairs?) until the owner first pays the bill for their error in
paying the PCN in breach of the CRA?
So Tesla keep digging a deeper hole for themselves to be
extricated from.
#Post#: 22105--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: May 10, 2024, 4:11 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
OP, what are your practical options?
To know what you could do we need to know how urgent and
important are these repairs. If you could live with the
consequence of them being delayed then pursue the matter with
Tesla and NCP.
Back to NCP and the alleged breaches. Clearly, whatever you did
to forestall getting a parking charge failed. So pl expand on
this.
#Post#: 22148--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: zunaster
Date: May 11, 2024, 12:15 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Thank you DWMB2, b789 & H C Andersen :)
--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> OP, what are your practical options?
>
> To know what you could do we need to know how urgent and
important are these repairs. If you could live with the
consequence of them being delayed then pursue the matter with
Tesla and NCP.
>
> Back to NCP and the alleged breaches. Clearly, whatever you
did to forestall getting a parking charge failed. So pl expand
on this.
>
>
>
>
--- End Quote ---
The manager of my apartment's management company will be back
from her holiday on Monday and I've been informed that she will
assist me in resolving the NCP tickets. I ensured to inform the
management company to exempt the loaner vehicle from fines while
it was parked in my bay during my car's repair. It's highly
probable that my management company will handle the invoice from
Tesla. If Tesla hadn't already paid for these tickets, they
could have potentially been cancelled, as NCP has previously
rectified similar mistakes with other residents in my building,
resulting in cancelled tickets.
--- Quote from: b789 link ---
>
> I don't quite understand how this can be. Surely, the loaner
car was provided so that the owner could use it whilst their own
car was being repaired. How long was this loaner car provided
for. Surely the parking charges would have taken days if not up
to 2 weeks to arrive at Tesla.
>
> Are Tesla trying to hold the owner to ransom by telling them
that they will not begin to do the repairs (are they warranty
repairs?) until the owner first pays the bill for their error in
paying the PCN in breach of the CRA?
>
> So Tesla keep digging a deeper hole for themselves to be
extricated from.
>
--- End Quote ---
I had a loaner vehicle from 4 March to 11 April. The tickets
invoice forwarded by Tesla on 4 May pertains to dates 22 March,
24 March and 11 April — all of which have been settled. However,
I am uncertain if tickets for other dates were issued.
The repairs are covered under warranty. Fortunately, all
concerns, primarily cosmetic (such as marks on the car chair and
paintwork) were reported to Tesla upon collecting the car. Tesla
is obligated to address these snags at no additional cost. While
it has taken over a year to resolve 50% of my concerns, the
remaining snags are scheduled to be addressed starting 15 May.
My options:
1. I'll discuss the NCP tickets with my management company on
Monday (13 May). Given that they were notified before parking,
I'm confident they'll understand the situation. While it's
unlikely that NCP will refund the money, if necessary, the
management company will need to compensate me to settle Tesla's
invoice.
2. Once I ascertain my management company's decision, I intend
to reach out to Tesla with the following email:
Their email to me with all PCNs on 4 May:
HTML https://i.ibb.co/jfD8h4c/Screenshot-2024-05-11-174741.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/mT4RJzL
light
HTML https://emoticoncentral.com/category/lighthttps://ibb.co/mT4RJzL
The PCN for 22 March, others are in the same format:
HTML https://i.ibb.co/x6R24BD/GM69-OGJ-Parking-with-no-permit-0912am-100-redacted.jpg
HTML https://ibb.co/SB96LMP
Dear Tesla Customer Service Team,
I am writing to you regarding a recent charges I received for a
parking violation while I had a loaner vehicle from Tesla for
warranty repairs. I would like to dispute these charges and
bring to your attention some concerns regarding the terms of the
loaner agreement.
Upon reviewing the loaner agreement that I signed before
collecting the vehicle, I noticed a clause stating that Tesla
reserves the right to pay parking fines or charges on my behalf
and pass on these costs, including an additional administrative
fee, to me. While I understand the intention behind this clause,
I believe it may be in violation of consumer protection laws,
specifically the Consumer Rights Act 2015.
Under Section 62 of the CRA 2015, a term in a contract is
considered unfair if it causes a significant imbalance in the
parties' rights and obligations under the contract to the
detriment of the consumer. The clause in question may be deemed
unfair as it potentially takes away my right to appeal the
parking charge by allowing Tesla to pay it without consulting me
or considering my rights.
I want to emphasize that while I acknowledge my responsibility
for any legitimate parking charges incurred during my use of the
loaner vehicle, I believe Tesla's action of charging me without
proper consideration of my rights is unjust and potentially
unlawful.
I would like to request that Tesla reconsider the charge and
provide clarification on the process followed in handling
parking charges incurred while in possession of a loaner
vehicle. Additionally, I would appreciate your assistance in
addressing any potential discrepancies in the application of the
loaner agreement terms.
I am willing to cooperate fully to resolve this matter amicably
and trust that Tesla shares the same commitment to fair and
transparent customer service.
I look forward to your prompt response and resolution of this
issue.
Yours sincerely,
#Post#: 22154--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: b789
Date: May 11, 2024, 12:56 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Interestingly, there is no mention of what the keeper should do
if the vehicle is a hire car. Whilst I cannot find anything in
PoFA that requires the operator to state anything in the NtK
about informing the keeper about transferring liability from
them to the hirer, it is usually standard practice to advise the
keeper (if they happen to be a hire firm) of the ability to do
so.
Also, there is nothing in the IPC CoP that requires the operator
to make the keeper aware of the requirement to transfer
liability to the hirer if the vehicle is out on hire. PoFA
9(2)(e)(ii)
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted<br
/>does not cover this as it requires the keeper to notify the
operator of the name of the "driver". The keeper cannot know the
name of the "driver", only the name of the "hirer".
However, by not advising the keeper of the requirement to
transfer liability to the hirer, the operator has failed to
provide the necessary information in order for them to
subsequently pursue the hirer and issue the necessary NtH.
#Post#: 22160--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: May 11, 2024, 3:38 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Take the rest of the weekend off and prepare yourself for
Monday.
Either your approach was wrong or the mgmt co. dealt with it
wrongly, you need to find out to avoid a repeat.
#Post#: 33156--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: zunaster
Date: August 12, 2024, 3:57 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Dear DWMB2 and b789,
Tesla has charged me for the PCNs, which I never authorized. I'm
currently pursuing reimbursement from the private parking
company, but I've been informed that since Tesla has already
paid the fine, they’ve accepted liability, making it difficult
to get a refund. How should I proceed?
The first invoice
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/916cfd95
was issued on 17 June and
second invoice
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/64d7cfe6
was issued on 25 June.
The PCNs are attached:
For parking at my residence:
1. 22.03
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/8f420847
2. 24.03
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/4625bfd8
3. 01.04
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/2b0efca8
4. 03.04
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/e7e1b614
5. 07.04
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/7c603ccf
6. 09.04
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/a2a8f4dc
7. 11.04
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/0d46ef76
For Heathrow drop off:
1. 01.04
HTML https://pdfupload.io/docs/ae4f5ae5
#Post#: 33175--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: b789
Date: August 12, 2024, 6:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Your dispute is with Tesla. They paid the charges. They
shouldn’t have done so.
#Post#: 33178--------------------------------------------------
Re: Private PCN paid by loaner car company
DIR By: zunaster
Date: August 13, 2024, 12:39 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes, but they have charged me. I just found out day before
yesterday that they have taken £540 approx from my account.
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