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#Post#: 19105--------------------------------------------------
LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: sugarray
Date: April 5, 2024, 12:44 pm
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Hi all hope you're having a great Friday! I received this pcn
but don't recall going through it. I know the area and can't
think for the life of me why I went through. It's so long ago is
there merit to this pcn? We have a lease car still with the
finance company which is on the log book. Not sure what to do.
Any ideas?
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1BddbNrQ2zOw7pmeoSUpScmd4naGSTnSJ/view?usp=sharing
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nKMdLXkgGfkRPsOmj7SZrn0ZUS2o_HkQ/view?usp=sharing
#Post#: 19121--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: April 5, 2024, 5:12 pm
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So, four months after the alleged contravention, you get a PCN
in the post for it and your car is leased.
As this is a lease car, the first PCN would have been sent to
the lease company, who can submit representations that they are
a lease company and give your name and address as the party
leasing the car on the date of the alleged contravention. The
council can then cancel the first PCN and issue a second one to
the supplied name and address. However, there is a 28 day limit
on serving PCNs from date of contravention in the Act under
which they have issued the PCN. They have another 28 days to
issue the 2nd PCN after cancelling the first, but on he face of
it, here it does look as if they are trying it on, and are
out-of-time.
However, there is nothing in the Act that imposes a time limit
on them receiving reps from the lease company, and then
accepting those reps and advising of cancellation. The date of
them advising the lease company that they accept their
representations is therefore key to the matter. So, you need to
request the lease company to supply you with the date of the
letter advising them that their reps have been accepted. Count
28 days from that, and if your PCN is dated beyond it, they are
out-of-time to issue the PCN.
Of course none of the above even starts to look at whether the
contravention occurred at all, so more information is needed if
you can remember it. There will be a video, and that is the sole
evidence of the alleged contravention. You can probably view
this on the Haringey website.
The other aspect is whether your agreement with the lease
company is a valid one for the purposes of the Act which refers
to "Hire" company. See Schedule 1 Para 1 (9): -
(9)In this paragraph, “vehicle hiring agreement” and
“vehicle-hire firm” have the same meanings as in section 66 of
the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 (c. 53) (Hired vehicles).
The Act they have issued the PCN under is the London Local
Authorities & Transport for London Act 2003
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2003/3/contents/enacted.
Others on here are far more experienced in the LLA & TfL Act
2003, so wait a bit for more input, but don't miss any deadlines
on the PCN.
#Post#: 19152--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: April 6, 2024, 9:20 am
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Well the PCN is dated 25 March so you have until 23 April to
make representations. Starting with the basics, please give us
the PCN number and the number plate.
Virtually all lease cases can be won as local authorities don't
understand the transfer of liability process, the leading case
on the topic is Harold Goodrich v City of Westminster
(2220668661, 14 August 2023)
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kuCsSSwWJGzgs82ld7wEkPOuKa9IM-vS/view
It is also likely there's more to it in this case, as the delay
suggests they've either been slow in responding to the lease
company's representations, or maybe they've even missed a
statutory deadline.
#Post#: 19401--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: April 9, 2024, 12:41 pm
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Video:
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQHnyL4acsk
I'd make a very basic challenge:
[indent]
Dear London Borough of Haringey,
We challenge liability on the ground that the alleged
contravention did not occur.
Yours faithfully,
[/indent]
Send it online via the council website and keep a screenshot of
the confirmation page.
#Post#: 19498--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: sugarray
Date: April 11, 2024, 6:38 am
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Done, thanks. Will update in due course.
#Post#: 22801--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: sugarray
Date: May 17, 2024, 5:16 am
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Haringey rejected the appeal please see below
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1uIsEg-qckS8djeVBXrApjBqN6eRNNsJu/view?usp=sharing
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1UB-8ybDpzMfte3E0qEbMIwApRlbsG2Xe/view?usp=sharing
Any ideas?
#Post#: 23213--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: sugarray
Date: May 20, 2024, 11:14 am
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Guys anyone available at the moment?
#Post#: 23983--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: May 27, 2024, 7:27 am
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[member=740]sugarray[/member] sorry for the delay I've been
swamped with cases. I'll drop you a PM.
#Post#: 23992--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: guest17
Date: May 27, 2024, 8:16 am
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Paradise Lodge Hotel?
Interesting!
Is there a named driver on the lease?
Mike
#Post#: 24161--------------------------------------------------
Re: LTN From Last Year Grrr
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: May 27, 2024, 5:06 pm
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--- Quote from: MMV Redux link ---
>
> Paradise Lodge Hotel?
>
> Interesting!
>
--- End Quote ---
Indeed it's not the first time, see Paradise Lodge Ltd v London
Borough of Haringey (2230244220, 24 June 2023)
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/19YxatxgFsJxdcR3Jzp9ThcYReJ0nXbDv/view
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