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#Post#: 18980--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: April 3, 2024, 6:07 pm
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--- Quote from: Donostio link ---
>
> In case it makes a difference the block is mostly residential
and includes some retail units.
>
--- End Quote ---
That doesn't really make much difference, there's clear signs
and road markings that say it's private property so that's good
enough for our purposes. The council won't be able to formulate
a response that the adjudicator would accept, because they don't
know what they're doing.
#Post#: 18981--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: Donostio
Date: April 3, 2024, 6:08 pm
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Super, thanks. I will update in due course.
#Post#: 18987--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: Donostio
Date: April 4, 2024, 3:57 am
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Submitted. I had to edit the text down to fit the 1,000
character limit. I managed to do so while keeping the key words
and references.
Case number: MT87744271
Vehicle registration: EN14NXK
Contravention: 31J - Box Junction
Date and time of contravention: 14/03/2024 16:34
This is an email from London Borough of Merton to acknowledge we
are in receipt of your online submission regarding your Penalty
Charge Notice (PCN).
Whilst the challenge is being reviewed, we will put your case on
hold. We will carefully consider your comments and make a
decision based on the evidence that is available to us and we
will formally respond in due course. Although we aim to respond
in full within 15 working days, please note that we are
currently working through a high volume of correspondence,
possibly resulting in a longer response time.
If your challenge is accepted, you will not have to pay the
charge and we will send you confirmation that the penalty charge
is cancelled.
If your challenge is rejected, we will explain the reasons for
our decision.
If your submission is received within the discounted period that
is stated on the PCN then the opportunity to pay the PCN at the
reduced rate will be re-offered in the event that the charge is
upheld.
Informal challenge (Parking and Bus Lane PCNs only):
Appeals that are made within 28 days of the PCN being issued are
classed as informal challenges and we will respond as soon as
possible.
Formal representation: Appeals that are made within 28 days of
receiving a PCN (Moving Traffic/Approved device), Notice to
Owner (Parking) or Enforcement Notice (Bus Lane) are classed as
formal representations. Please note that each type of
contravention requires a response within timescales set out in
the legislation relevant to that type of offence and we will
therefore respond within this legislative time frame (up to 56
days for Parking offences, up to 3 months for Moving Traffic
Offence and while there is no legal time scale in which we must
response to formal representations relating to Bus Lane
offences, we endeavour to reply within 3 months).
Do not pay the PCN, if you want to make a challenge. If you do,
the case will be considered closed as you have accepted
liability.
Reason for appeal: 'The penalty charge exceeded the amount
applicable in the circumstances of the case '
Your answers:
-Question 1 : 'Please explain in as much detail as possible why
you think your PCN should be cancelled'
Answer : 'Alleged contravention did not occur- the box
junction is not at the intersection of two or more roads or
outside a police, fire or ambulance station. It is at the
entrance to an apartment complex private driveway, the Traffic
Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016 do not permit box
junction markings at such a location.
It follows that no contravention can occur at this location,
enforcement must cease and CCTV enforcement cameras at this
location be removed. There is no traffic enforcement
justification for the camera here, failure to remove or disable
the camera would mean unlawful and unjustified capture of
personal data, in contravention of the General Data Protection
Regulation.
I further challenge liability for PCN MT87744271 on the basis
that information referenced in the PCN’s 2nd paragraph on page
two does not convey the contents of paragraph 1(4) of Schedule 1
to the London Local Authorities and Transport for London Act
2003, so it follows that the PCN must be cancelled'
-Question 2 : 'Would you like to upload any other documents to
support your case?'
Answer : 'No'
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 19049--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: April 4, 2024, 5:09 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Donostio link ---
>
> Submitted. I had to edit the text down to fit the 1,000
character limit.
>
--- End Quote ---
For future reference, the workaround is to put the
representation in a PDF and just say "see attached".
#Post#: 27713--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: Donostio
Date: June 27, 2024, 10:35 am
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I finally got a reply.
They do specifically address my challenge:
'You have automatically committed an offence if:
1) You entered the yellow box junction and stopped behind a
stationary vehicle.
2) Any part of your vehicle is inside the yellow box junction
and your vehicle is
stationary.
I must advise that all box junctions enforced by the London
Borough of Merton are
compliant to the Traffic Signs Regulations and General
Directions 2016.
The yellow box is considered essential to maintain flow of
traffic and to ensure that
traffic queues do not impact the signalised junction due to
motorists waiting to turn right
into the estate. It also ensures that motorists from the estate
can exit.
Yellow boxes are permitted across junctions / access roads even
if it provides access to
a private estate.
I am satisfied that the notice has been correctly issued and
that there are no grounds in
which to cancel the charge.'
Should I plough on and risk the fine doubling? £65.00 if I pay
by 5th July.
I can't get the up-loader to work (full message)
Here's a link to the PDF of the letter:
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WX2dbAqHVGSecX_Et6b9WMb49cUZIYM3/view?usp=drive_link
#Post#: 27714--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: Donostio
Date: June 27, 2024, 10:40 am
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.
#Post#: 27975--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: June 30, 2024, 7:26 am
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[member=1448]Donostio[/member] the notice of rejection gives you
a failure to consider, as they have completely ignored the
certain point of your representation. At this point I have to
say there's at least a 90% chance of a successful appeal as long
as the appeal is argued properly.
I'm going to drop you a PM in case you'd like me to represent
you, though of course you have the option of representing
yourself.
Whatever you do, I would not be paying the council in a case
like this as they're effectively just running a scam, pure and
simple (though this is down to their ignorance and incompetence
rather than any deliberate conspiracy).
#Post#: 28304--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: Donostio
Date: July 2, 2024, 5:54 am
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Thank you
I'm away cycling in France this week. I'll give the appeal ago
on my own, but thanks again.
One question - the deadline to pay 'at discount' is in a couple
of days but the deadline to appeal is in another two weeks. Can
I submit my appeal after I get back next week (after the payment
deadline)?
#Post#: 28328--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: MrChips
Date: July 2, 2024, 9:40 am
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If/when you do take this to the tribunal, ensure you are present
to explain your case rather than allowing the adjudicator to
base a decision on the paperwork only.
Also ensure you have sufficient evidence (eg photos from google
maps) that the junction is with a private road.
You don't want to end up like this other recent case...
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/tfl-yellow-box-hanger-lane/
#Post#: 28403--------------------------------------------------
Re: 31J Entering and stopping ina box junction when prohibited
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 2, 2024, 6:35 pm
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--- Quote from: Donostio link ---
>
> One question - the deadline to pay 'at discount' is in a
couple of days but the deadline to appeal is in another two
weeks. Can I submit my appeal after I get back next week (after
the payment deadline)?
>
--- End Quote ---
If you're appealing then the discount is irrelevant; you have 28
days from the date of service to file an appeal at the tribunal.
Given the per-incuriam outcome in Jain and Jain Ltd v Transport
for London (2240112496, 21 May 2024)
HTML https://drive.google.com/file/d/132C2vLpN5eQaRDt08QfUXsLpLKxCiKUw/view<br
/>I don't think this is suitable for a DIY appeal, but obviously
it's your money on the line so you must decide how to proceed.
If you are appealing yourself make sure to request a hearing,
you do not want a decision on the papers under any
circumstances.
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