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#Post#: 18321--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: Sonu rocks
Date: March 25, 2024, 8:19 pm
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The appeal was as per below:
''The driver had parked as the child was feeling ill and wanted
to throw up. The driver exited the car to see if her child had
thrown up and to provide some water. In the meantime, the
parking attendant (very trickily whilst looking elsewhere) took
the pictures and he was in such a rush to take the pictures that
he had not filled the column on the PCN where he had to mention
the colour of the car. The pictures he took are very blurred
(even the number plate is not clear) showing the intention and
cruelty of the parking warden. The warden did not want to listen
to anything when spoken to''.
Please see below the rejection from the council
HTML https://ibb.co/1szj9jg
HTML https://ibb.co/pwF0SRv
#Post#: 18332--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: March 26, 2024, 4:23 am
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It's the usual Fob-Off letter sent out in response to 99% of
informal challenges, (probaably 100% !!), that totally ignores
your representations. If it were me I'd follow 'cp8759's advice.
#Post#: 18339--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: March 26, 2024, 6:33 am
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IMO, nothing in what you've said comes near 'an emergency'
within the meaning of the Act, plus of course there's no
independent evidence in support. In any event you could have
pulled in to the side of the road. I would not risk the discount
on this point but you can put it to the council and if you do I
suggest you strip out the emotion and simply concentrate on the
facts. In which respect what does 'The warden did not want to
listen to anything when spoken to' mean?
Did the driver speak to the CEO? Where did this take place? Did
the driver show the CEO their child and try to explain? What did
the CEO say? How was the PCN served e.g. by hand to the driver
or on the vehicle? If this took place at the vehicle, then the
CEO must have noticed the child etc..
#Post#: 18445--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: Sonu rocks
Date: March 27, 2024, 10:19 am
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--- Quote from: H C Andersen link ---
>
> IMO, nothing in what you've said comes near 'an emergency'
within the meaning of the Act, plus of course there's no
independent evidence in support. In any event you could have
pulled in to the side of the road. I would not risk the discount
on this point but you can put it to the council and if you do I
suggest you strip out the emotion and simply concentrate on the
facts. In which respect what does 'The warden did not want to
listen to anything when spoken to' mean?
>
> Did the driver speak to the CEO? Where did this take place?
Did the driver show the CEO their child and try to explain? What
did the CEO say? How was the PCN served e.g. by hand to the
driver or on the vehicle? If this took place at the vehicle,
then the CEO must have noticed the child etc..
>
--- End Quote ---
The driver spoke with the CEO but he sneakily took pictures of
the car and he saw the child sitting in the back. CEO quickly
printed the ticket and placed it on the windscreen. CEO did this
job within couple of minutes and left.
#Post#: 18705--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: March 31, 2024, 3:57 pm
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What a nonsense rejection, I'd definitely wait for the notice to
owner.
#Post#: 22689--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: Sonu rocks
Date: May 16, 2024, 6:38 am
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How long does the council have to issue NTO after they have
rejected the appeal? or is there any timeframe they are legally
abiding to notify the owner?
#Post#: 22698--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: May 16, 2024, 8:08 am
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The statutory limit is 6 months, but the Statutory Guidance says
this: -
--- Quote ---
> Issuing the notice to owner
> If the penalty charge is not paid the enforcement authority
may issue a notice to owner (NtO). The purpose of this is to
ensure that the PCN was received by the vehicle owner and to
remind the vehicle owner that the payment in full is now due
and, if it is not paid within a further 28 days, it may be
increased.
>
> The NtO may be issued 28 days after serving the penalty
charge, and we expect authorities to send them within 56 days.
The ultimate time limit, in exceptional circumstances, is 6
months [footnote 33] from the ‘relevant date’. There should be a
very good reason for waiting that long to serve an NtO. The
regulations set out the information that the NtO must [footnote
34] give.
--- End Quote ---
Section 87 of the Transport Management Act 2004 stipulates that
local authorities must have regard to the information contained
in this guidance. So, if they exceed the 56 days, they would be
expected to explain why, and an adjudicator could decide their
reason given for delay is not reasonable, and is an abuse of
process.
#Post#: 22704--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: Sonu rocks
Date: May 16, 2024, 8:46 am
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Thank you!
So it has been 68 days since the date on the PCN. Does this mean
if they send out the NTO now the owner can argue why they have
take that long and that it is not valid unless they provide a
strong reasoning?
#Post#: 22708--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: May 16, 2024, 9:15 am
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Much depends on circumstances whether the NtO has been issued
unfairly late in the process. On March 26th you posted their
rejection of your informal representations against the PCN. So
at the moment, I don't think you can use this argument, as it is
only about a month and a hlaf since then.
#Post#: 22731--------------------------------------------------
Re: Hounslow Council PCN - Cecil road
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: May 16, 2024, 12:26 pm
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OP, the rejection letter seems to have disappeared.
OP, can I check a couple of facts with you while we await the
NTO.
Did you leave the car at any time?
What were you doing when the CEO arrived?
The council's duty under the Traffic Management Act is 'to have
regard'. If the council's policy is to endeavour to issue within
56 days, then so be it.
No-one can quantify when 'we did our best/staff shortages etc.'
crosses the 'exceptional circumstances' threshold.
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