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#Post#: 1097--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: Used2BCabbyman
Date: July 10, 2023, 12:20 pm
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Thank you for the new beginning. I gather that the problems
with PPP started a few weeks ago; shows you how often I pop in!
I will try to improve. ;)
#Post#: 1098--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: andy_foster
Date: July 10, 2023, 12:36 pm
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If you are hosting the site, you have control over its security.
If you are not hosting the site, you have no control over its
security.
#Post#: 1099--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 10, 2023, 1:45 pm
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What "secure" data is held on this public forum exactly?
#Post#: 1100--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 10, 2023, 2:22 pm
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So we had our first "incident" today, and were offline for a
bit.
I raised a support ticket and we were back online within 43
minutes:
HTML https://support.createaforum.com/8/domain-not-working/new/?topicseen#new
Compared to the pepipoo hosting provider that previously didn't
respond to Fredd for days at a time, I think that's a definite
improvement.
#Post#: 1131--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: notmeatloaf
Date: July 11, 2023, 5:36 pm
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--- Quote from: cp8759 link ---
>
> What "secure" data is held on this public forum exactly?
>
--- End Quote ---
Well, people are asking for legal advice with their IP address.
IP address is personal data under GDPR and bearing in mind
police forces used to scrape the old Pepipoo (hence using images
for police forces) no doubt they will eventually do the same
here.
There's a reason why if you are taking legal advice from a
solicitor you don't send an anonymous transcript of the
conversation to the police to see if they can match it up with
an existing case.
But if you think the data on this site has no value either to
the admins or anyone else, whether it be the police or someone
trying to make money that is your decision. CaF obviously see
value in the data which is why they monetise the links.
#Post#: 1132--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 11, 2023, 5:50 pm
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What is a police force going to do with an IP address? As I
understand it they would need a warrant to obtain the
subscriber's details from an ISP, they can't just call up
Vodafone or BT and get a name and address.
And not being funny but even if the police identified an OP from
an IP address, so what? If an OP comes here and we identify a
defence worth running (faulty TRO, signs not giving adequate
guidance, 1st NIP posted on day 15 or whatever else) there is
nothing the police could find on here that would help them. At
most, they'd realise there isn't a reasonable prospect of
conviction and they'd just let it go.
If we identify that there is no defence worth running, the OP is
no worse off than before (after all as far as the police are
concerned they had enough evidence to get a conviction all
along).
CaF uses the ad revenue to pay for hosting the site, which
effectively costs nothing at all to run (aside from a nominal
yearly fee for the domain and SSL functionality).
We could pay a monthly fee to remove the CaF ads and then put
our own ads up to generate ad revenue to pay the fees, but it
seems like a lot of faffing about for no real benefit.
#Post#: 1185--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: sparx
Date: July 12, 2023, 2:07 pm
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--- Quote from: notmeatloaf link ---
>
> Well, people are asking for legal advice with their IP
address. IP address is personal data under GDPR and bearing in
mind police forces used to scrape the old Pepipoo (hence using
images for police forces) no doubt they will eventually do the
same here.
>
> There's a reason why if you are taking legal advice from a
solicitor you don't send an anonymous transcript of the
conversation to the police to see if they can match it up with
an existing case.
>
> But if you think the data on this site has no value either to
the admins or anyone else, whether it be the police or someone
trying to make money that is your decision. CaF obviously see
value in the data which is why they monetise the links.
>
--- End Quote ---
I'd argue that a lot of things on this forum are "slam dunks",
i.e. even if the opposing party knows of it, there's nothing
they can do as they've already buggered it up. What cp said.
Third parties cannot see IPs of users, so unless there's a data
leak (which is *more likely* on PPP, rather than here), or the
police request data from the site owners (which, being run by an
off shore company, on servers in the USA, would probably be an
impressive undertaking for otherwise minor traffic offences),
then no one is seeing them...
What data may identify users, is data that has been posted on
PPP for many years. Offence dates and times, copies of NIPs and
location of offence, etc. Private parking companies and councils
are also at it. That's data that you can't leave out of a post,
because you need it to provide advice.
"CaF see value in the data" - bollocks. Monetising text or links
is not a new concept, and not isolated to the data posted on
this forum. There is almost certainly no human interaction, or
any consideration (by the algorithm) of what the data on this
forum actually is... (i'd be interested if it monetised the word
bollocks).
#Post#: 1203--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: notmeatloaf
Date: July 12, 2023, 5:32 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: cp8759 link ---
>
> What is a police force going to do with an IP address? As I
understand it they would need a warrant to obtain the
subscriber's details from an ISP, they can't just call up
Vodafone or BT and get a name and address.
>
> And not being funny but even if the police identified an OP
from an IP address, so what? If an OP comes here and we identify
a defence worth running (faulty TRO, signs not giving adequate
guidance, 1st NIP posted on day 15 or whatever else) there is
nothing the police could find on here that would help them. At
most, they'd realise there isn't a reasonable prospect of
conviction and they'd just let it go.
>
> If we identify that there is no defence worth running, the OP
is no worse off than before (after all as far as the police are
concerned they had enough evidence to get a conviction all
along).
>
> CaF uses the ad revenue to pay for hosting the site, which
effectively costs nothing at all to run (aside from a nominal
yearly fee for the domain and SSL functionality).
>
> We could pay a monthly fee to remove the CaF ads and then put
our own ads up to generate ad revenue to pay the fees, but it
seems like a lot of faffing about for no real benefit.
>
--- End Quote ---
It's very easy to Geolocate an IP address sufficiently to link
it to an existing case.
To be honest I'm a bit surprised at your cavalier approach to
user data but if you aren't concerned about having no control
over website security or data then the current solution should
be fine. I would definitely recommend speaking to anyone who was
around when it because clear the police are/were scraping data
from Pepipoo en masse to see if allowing even easier access this
time is a good idea.
Maybe users won't mind posting knowing police forces are
analysing every post on the site.
#Post#: 1205--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: ivanleo
Date: July 12, 2023, 5:49 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: notmeatloaf link ---
>
> To be honest I'm a bit surprised at your cavalier approach to
user data but if you aren't concerned about having no control
over website security or data then the current solution should
be fine. I would definitely recommend speaking to anyone who was
around when it because clear the police are/were scraping data
from Pepipoo en masse to see if allowing even easier access this
time is a good idea.
>
> Maybe users won't mind posting knowing police forces are
analysing every post on the site.
>
--- End Quote ---
Scraping data from a public website is something anyone can do
anyway, and has nothing to do with security?
I don't know what you mean by even easier access, to the extent
that any security is required, I'm sure this website has better
security than pepipoo.
It was either you or someone else who pointed out that with
modern techniques, it would be child's play for anyone with the
right skills to get anyone's pepipoo password (including
presumably Fredd's password) and have a look at whatever they
wanted.
To get IP addresses UK police forces would need to launch an
international investigation in partnership with US authorities,
which makes zero sense for anything but the most serious of
crimes. If we were talking about murder, people smuggling,
importing machine guns or terrorism then sure, they'd get
warrants in the US in no time. For minor traffic offences, not
so much.
I'm sure you could come up with some super-duper security
solutions that could make this website an impenetrable vault,
but it seems to me that you've got a solution looking for a
problem.
And frankly I think the idea that the police sit around all day
trawling forums like this one is for the birds, after all
there's people who openly advertise drugs for sale on facebook
or gumtree and nothing seems to get done about that.
As far as I recall, the one guy who got sent to prison was the
one who bragged about perverting the course of justice on the
forum, and it was a forum member who actually reported him to
the police.
#Post#: 1220--------------------------------------------------
Re: A new beginning
DIR By: notmeatloaf
Date: July 13, 2023, 4:13 am
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You're forgetting how much more manpower the police put into
prosecuting motorists then drug dealers.
Anyway, ultimately it's your choice. I think it is unwise to
rely on a one man band in Illinois but you're right in that
comparing it to the old forums this is still better. If you'd
like assistance setting it up on your own hosting the offer is
still there, takes all of 15 minutes to do and IMO will
futureproof the site a lot better.
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