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#Post#: 121252--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: MrChips
Date: June 9, 2026, 6:09 am
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You can update your appeal wording close up to the actual appeal
date.
If you post what you've written here we can maybe refine it for
you.
#Post#: 121263--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: June 9, 2026, 6:32 am
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Case 2260035795 is compelling and Greenwich must have seen it,
so you can put them on notice that you will seek costs if they
contest.
#Post#: 121349--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: gmoney
Date: June 10, 2026, 4:34 am
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Here we are:
Further information about the appeal: In accordance with the
London Local Authorities and Transport for London Act 2003, my
challenge is on the basis that the contravention did not occur
as detailed in the points below.
1. According to “The Traffic Signs Regulations and General
Directions 2016” “the location of the “box junction” means an
area of the carriageway where the marking has been placed and
which is
• (a) at a junction between two or more roads;
• (b) at a gyratory system or roundabout;
• (c) along a length of a two-way road (other than at a
junction), the carriageway of which is not greater than 4.5
metres wide at its narrowest point; or
• (d) on the length of road adjacent to the vehicular entrance
to the premises of a fire, police or ambulance station
However the box junction at this location on Blackwall Lane does
not satisfy any of these conditions. (b), (c) and (d) clearly do
not apply.
(a) is not applicable for the following reasons:
• As noted in the Location on the PCN itself, the junction is
immediately outside a private business “Meantime Brewery”. As
per a photo from Google Street view, this entrance is not a
road, but rather the entrance to a business.
• Immediately behind the gate is an additional sign “No Public
Access”
• In addition, the gate is locked at the time of the alleged
offence, so this is not a road with public access and confirms
the usage of this entrance as that to a private business.
• According to Section 192 of the road traffic 1988 a road has a
definition of “any highway and any other road to which the
public has access”. This is clearly an entrance to a deliveries
yard, not a road. I've included an image of the closest turning,
'Mauritius Road', which looks like a road, is a road, and is
sign posted as a road. Therefore it would be reasonable to
expect a box junction there. It's not reasonable to expect one
outside meantime brewery, which makes the existing box junction
overly punitive, especially in the context of the offence, which
was a slow but steady stream of traffic in the dark over a box
in an extremely unusual location. This is not a junction, and
should be marked with a Keep Clear sign. In the evidence
provided, it can also be seen there is no street lighting, and
the box, whilst visible from the camera, was not so from the
ground
All this is less relevant however than the sheer fact that a
yellow box can only legally be placed at a junction between two
roads. The entrance to Meantime Brewery is locked with no public
access, so clearly is not a public highway and therefore not a
road. Schedule 9, Part 7, 11 (6) of the TSRGD 20016 sets out the
permitted locations for yellow boxes. In addition Section 192 of
the road traffic 1988 defines a "road" as: “any highway and any
other road to which the public has access”. This location does
not meet any of these criteria and it is thus an illegal yellow
box.
3. The length of time when my car was stationary was precisely 6
seconds and given the entrance at this point on the carriageway
was closed, no obstruction or possible obstruction took place.
This length of stationary time and the fact no obstruction to
other vehicles took place means this PCN is therefore not
reasonable.
Regarding the 1st ground for appeal, the adjudicator in a PCN
2220655535 at Addiscombe Road, Croydon as detailed on the London
Tribunals Environment and Traffic Adjudicators has noted that a
junction with a private business/entrance does not quality as a
junction under these regulations.
Regarding the 3rd ground for appeal, the adjudicator in a PCN
216036762A at Kingston Rd, Merton as detailed on the London
Tribunals Environment and Traffic Adjudicators has noted that 7
or 8 seconds can just about be said to be nominal or de minimis
and therefore not warranting a contravention.
In summary, this is clearly an illegally placed Yellow Box, and
the PCN is both extremely punitive by the nature of no
reasonable driver expecting it to be there, and unenforceable
That's what I've gone for - not a seasoned PCN pro but hopefully
carries the weight of the argument! But not precious, and more
than happy to replace with something worded better if you guys
feel that would be stronger
#Post#: 121352--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: June 10, 2026, 4:48 am
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Was that your initial challenge? Post their rejection.
If you are going to appeal to the tribunal I would cite the key
case I posted as I can't see another adjudicator disagreeing
with it and then add some bullet points to back it up.
#Post#: 121353--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: gmoney
Date: June 10, 2026, 4:55 am
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Initial challenge I just set out the legislation
The rejection stated
Having carefully considered your comments, we do not agree with
this assertion. The yellow box marking in question is positioned
at a junction where two or more roads meet... We are satisfied
that the location meets this criterion. the marking is therefore
lawful and has been correctly placed.
Aka computer says no
I believe the appeal is still processing, and the text can't be
updated. I'd submitted it before checking on here and seeing the
case you linked! But as above, it seems the text can be changed
once the appeal has been processed, so I will update it with
reference to that case when possible
#Post#: 121360--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: tincombe
Date: June 10, 2026, 6:05 am
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The NOR pl, all sides and only obscure your personal details.
#Post#: 121604--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: gmoney
Date: June 12, 2026, 8:26 am
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Here:
HTML https://imgpile.com/p/m6eTwyu
#Post#: 121607--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: tincombe
Date: June 12, 2026, 9:07 am
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Thanks.
So the council agree that 'the layout and purpose of the
markings are to prevent vehicles from stopping in the junction
and thereby obstructing the flow of traffic.'
This could only refer to conflicting traffic flows.
But there aren't any
Therefore whether pedestrian access to the crossover means that
it may be considered to be a road, the simple fact that with
current boundary configurations there cannot be any movement of
vehicles on this 'road' means that it NO LONGER fulfils the
council's purpose, is redundant and IMO cannot be enforced.
#Post#: 121637--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: June 12, 2026, 12:27 pm
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It's just a worthless template rejection.
Register a tribunal appeal and put the council on notice you
will seek costs if they contest.
#Post#: 121697--------------------------------------------------
Re: Greenwich Borough PCN Meantime Brewery 31J Blackwall Ln
DIR By: JoCo
Date: June 13, 2026, 8:54 am
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I would add that the Meantime Brewery has been closed since
2024. Beer production moved to Chiswick. The associated Tap
Room bar is also closed and the site is derelict.
So not even an active private road.
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