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       #Post#: 113938--------------------------------------------------
       SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: k2897
       Date: March 21, 2026, 7:35 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       I've just received an SJPN in the post today for a speeding
       offence that took place in September 2025. I was going 61mph in
       a temporary 50mph zone on the M4.
       They end of September they sent a NIP to my old address with a
       further reminder letter in October to that same address. And
       now, 6 months from the date of offence I've received a SJPN with
       2 offences: speeding and failure to provide drivers details
       (s172)
       I've read through the paperwork they've sent me and there's a
       section that states: "If your summons contains 2 offences, they
       are 'laid in the alternative'. This means that if you choose to
       plead guilty to one offence and not guilty to the other the
       magistrates will only adjudicate on the offence to which you
       have pleaded guilty and the offence you pleaded not guilty will
       be withdrawn.
       Where there are 2 offences in the summons, and you choose to
       plead not guilty to both the case will be adjourned at the first
       hearing. You will then be notified of a trial date. You will
       have to attend the trial to give evidence in person."
       I was unaware that I had to update my V5C and the address has
       stayed the same on there since I bought the car and had assumed
       that if I update the address on my drivers licence when I move
       house (which I have done twice since then and kept updated), it
       automatically updates DVLA too. I only realised I have to update
       my V5C in November 2025 and I did it right then. Now my V5C has
       the correct address but it didn't at the date of the offence. I
       do want to take responsibility for both of these offences,
       however to avoid getting 9 points (!!!) I'd like to take on the
       "laid in the alternative' deal they've mentioned. I've read
       through multiple other questions on here with the same situation
       and people haven't mentioned about this. I wasn't sure if
       they've just missed it or it's a new thing on my paperwork?
       I do appreciate that it is my fault for not updating my V5C, and
       so I'm concerned that if I choose not guilty for this offence in
       my response, once they read my explanation, they won't withdraw
       it and I'll end up with 9 points (on top my existing 3 points,
       I'd have 12 in total and basically lose my licence for 6
       months). I don't want to do the wrong thing here and get myself
       in more of a pickle. I really don't want to drag this on and go
       to court either.
       Is it the case that the offence I put not guilty just gets
       automatically withdrawn because I've admitted to the other, even
       though technically I am guilty of both? Is it likely/common
       practice for them to drop the s172 in these cases? what would be
       the best action here?
       #Post#: 113942--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: NewJudge
       Date: March 21, 2026, 8:24 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       You are indeed technically guilty of both (provided you agree
       you were speeding), though a speeding prosecution would not
       succeed without you pleading guilty as the police have no
       evidence that you were driving. However…
       --- Quote ---
       > Is it the case that the offence I put not guilty just gets
       automatically withdrawn because I've admitted to the other, even
       though technically I am guilty of both?
       --- End Quote ---
       Yes, that’s exactly what they’ve told you.
       It is, in fact a very convenient way of dealing with someone in
       your position. Not many courts do this. It is usually necessary
       to plead not guilty to both charges, attend court and do a deal
       with the prosecutor to drop the “Fail to Provide” (FtP) charge
       in return for a guilty plea to speeding.
       --- Quote ---
       > …what would be the best action here?
       --- End Quote ---
       Return the SJPN pleading guilty to speeding and not guilty to
       FtP.
       #Post#: 113958--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: k2897
       Date: March 21, 2026, 12:38 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Thankyou!! I really appreciate the rapid response!
       I guess I'm just worried they're going to redact what they've
       said after I basically own up in my explanation and tell them "I
       haven't updated my V5C because I didn't know I had to" and
       charge me for both. Should I even provide an explanation?
       #Post#: 113965--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: NewJudge
       Date: March 21, 2026, 1:51 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote ---
       > I guess I'm just worried they're going to redact what they've
       said after I basically own up in my explanation and tell them "I
       haven't updated my V5C because I didn't know I had to...
       --- End Quote ---
       Their agreement (to discontinue one charge if you plead guilty
       to the other) is not conditional on anything. Failure to update
       the V5C is one of the most common reasons that drivers find
       themselves in your position. When the usual strategy is employed
       (pleading not guilty to both charges and doing the “deal” I
       mentioned) it is rarely, if ever, declined by prosecutors. The
       court dealing with your case has simply made it easier for you.
       The court (or the prosecutor) would be very hard pushed to
       retract their offer as it essentially encourages you to plead
       guilty to speeding – a charge which would otherwise not stick
       without your guilty plea.
       In any case, you have no need to provide any explanation. If you
       want to provide one simply say your pleas are entered on the
       understanding that the charges are being laid “in the
       alternative.”
       #Post#: 118182--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: k2897
       Date: May 9, 2026, 11:24 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Thanks for everyone’s advice. I sent the letters back pleading
       guilty for the speeding and not guilty for the s172. I’ve just
       seen on the government website that last week they’ve given me 6
       points for “failure to give information as to identity of driver
       MS90”. So confused what’s happened there. It’s made me even
       doubt that I’ve filled in letter correctly. Do I just take the L
       and pay the fine (£660 !!) or do I dispute this? I’m so lost and
       frustrated. The laid in the alternative thing didn’t work?
       #Post#: 118184--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: NewJudge
       Date: May 9, 2026, 12:25 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Do I just take the L and pay the fine (£660 !!) or do I dispute
       this?
       Certainly not! You must dispute it.
       You have it in writing that if you plead guilty to one charge
       and not guilty to the other, the one to which you have pleaded
       not guilty will be withdrawn.
       If you responded as you say you did, even ignoring “the offences
       being laid in the alternative”, you should not have been
       convicted without facing a trial, for which you would have to
       attend in person.
       Did you keep a copy of your response?
       You need to contact the court to find out why you have been
       convicted of the offence to which you pleaded not guilty, when
       you had the firm understanding that it would be discontinued.
       #Post#: 118202--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: ManxTom
       Date: May 9, 2026, 7:34 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: k2897 link ---
       >
       > Thanks for everyone’s advice. I sent the letters back pleading
       guilty for the speeding and not guilty for the s172... It’s made
       me even doubt that I’ve filled in letter correctly. ...
       >
       --- End Quote ---
       Did you not keep a copy of the plea you sent back?
       #Post#: 118335--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: k2897
       Date: May 11, 2026, 9:11 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       No unfortunately I didn’t keep a copy of my answers on the paper
       form.
       I called up the magistrates court today to ask for a copy of the
       plea and court paper work that’s on file about the case. I
       didn’t even get to ask this question because as soon as they
       checked my details, they said they didn’t recieve the forms even
       though I sent it few days after I got the sjpn through the post.
       Thankfully I’ve kept receipt proof (physical receipt and photo
       of it) of me sending the forms off in time which matches the
       address I was to send my plea to. So no idea how they didn’t get
       it.
       I’ve now been asked to dispute it and go through the process.
       They said it can take 6 months to resolve this which is painful
       because now I have an extra 6 points on my licence!
       Would I have to physically go to court to dispute this and
       explain in person? Should I start paying the fine to avoid being
       penalised for an additional offence for “not paying a fine by a
       deadline” No idea how any of this works never done this before!
       Would appreciate any tips as usual!
       #Post#: 118340--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: NewJudge
       Date: May 11, 2026, 10:48 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       You will have to ask the court to re-open your case under s142
       of the Magistrates’ Court Act.
       The process for this is that your request will first be screened
       by an administrator. Be prepared to meet some resistance to your
       request. Do not mention the word “appeal” in your application.
       This is the usual reason for the administrators declining to put
       a request before the court and usually results in a form to
       appeal in the Crown Court being supplied. That is not what you
       want to do.
       Only the court can decide whether or not to re-open your case.
       It is a judicial decision to be taken by Magistrates, not an
       administrative one to be taken by a clerk. You must persevere if
       you meet that resistance.
       The reason for your request is quite simple: you were told that
       the offences were laid “in the alternative”. You pleaded guilty
       to speeding on the understanding that the “Fail to Provide”
       charge would be dropped. Unfortunately, your response was not
       received by the court and they convicted you, in your absence,
       of the FtP charge.
       I discovered a short while ago that you can begin this process
       online:
  HTML https://www.gov.uk/appeal-magistrates-court-decision/how-to-apply
       #Post#: 118559--------------------------------------------------
       Re: SJPN - 2 offences "laid in the alternative"
   DIR By: k2897
       Date: May 13, 2026, 8:15 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Thankyou! Yes I’m going to do that.
       I’m going through the online form for that and I just want to
       make sure I’m choosing the right options.
       So for “did you make a plea for the original offence” there’s
       two options. “yes, I made a plea but I think the decision was
       unfair/the judges failed to consider my circumstances or all the
       evidence available” the other option is “no, i didn’t know about
       the original hearing or was unable to make a plea” is the “no”
       option the better one considering my situation?
       If I click yes for the above, the follow up question is “did you
       get the chance to give an explanation of the offence to the
       court”
       Do I pick “yes- but I want to appeal the decision made” or “no-
       I was not able to speak or write to the court”. To avoid
       choosing the option with the word appeal in it, I was going pick
       no.
       If I pick no for that first question, then it takes me straight
       to a new question “do you think the court decision was unfair.
       Do you want your case to be reopened” to which I want to click
       yes.
       The next bit: “are you challenging the court finding that you
       are guilty or the outcome (sentence) of the original hearing. Or
       both”. Bit clueless which to pick here.
       It then asks me for more info on the plea and why I believe I
       did not commit the offence if I’m pleading not guilty. Then a
       separate section asking me to make pleas for more than one
       offence if applicable. For both these sections I’m assuming I
       just repeat the explanation about laid in the alternative and
       them not recieving my response etc. and nothing extra.
       Many thanks as always!
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