DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
Fans Of The Ventures
HTML https://fansoftheventures.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Guitars, Amps, Effects, etc.
*****************************************************
#Post#: 1136--------------------------------------------------
"Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: abstamaria Date: May 27, 2012, 2:22 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I was never savvy enough to know it, but have learned that Leo
Fender did introduce some confusion when he called his vibrato
arms “tremolo” arms and the tremolo effect in his amps
"vibrato." Here is an interesting article from Wikipedia that I
just dug up. See the last sentence, which somewhat vindicates
Leo, at least insofar as “vibrato” units are concerned.
I suppose if, one is referring to a Fender, one may call the bar
whatever Leo decided to name it – it was his bar. I may just use
“whammy bar,” but I’m already 63.
Here’s the article:
“The "synchronised tremolo" was introduced in 1955 on the first
Stratocaster guitar. The only previously successful "tremolo
arm" was the Bigsby vibrato tailpiece, often simply called a
"Bigsby". In 1958, Fender reinforced his usage with the "Fender
floating tremolo" on the Jazzmaster and some subsequent guitars.
The "synchronised tremolo" became the most copied of these three
basic patterns of "tremolo arm", although both of the others
continue to have some following.
In both the case of the "tremolo arm" and "vibrato unit", Leo
Fender had reversed the established usage of the terms vibrato
and tremolo. That is, he called a device that produced true
vibrato a "synchronised tremolo", and a device that produced
true tremolo a "vibrato unit". In fact he was using the terms
interchangeably. The first Fender vibrato unit (1954) was called
"tremolo", and some later Fender tremolo arms were called
"vibrato tailpieces" or similar.
But the terms that became established were "tremolo arm" and
"vibrato unit", both contrary to standard usage, with the result
that electric guitarists traditionally use the terms "vibrato"
and "tremolo" in the opposite senses to all other musicians when
describing these hardware devices and the effects they produce.
From time to time it is proposed that this should be corrected,
and the term "tremolo arm" rejected in favor either of "vibrato
arm" or of a neutral term such as "whammy bar", but there is no
corresponding "correct" term for a vibrato unit.
The task of producing a similarly "correct" term for a
traditional vibrato unit is slightly complicated by two factors:
• The subsequent development of other guitar effects units such
as chorus, phasers (sometimes called phase vibrato units) and
flamgers, which can be set to produce changes in pitch similar
to traditional vibrato as understood by most musicians.
• The fact that, under harmonic analysis and contrary to the
expectations of many musicians, the output of the original
vibrato unit does contain other frequencies near that of the
note frequencies and in place of the note frequencies. These are
the mathematical result of the variation in volume of the notes,
so there is a slight sense in which Leo Fender was correct in
his naming of the vibrato unit (but not of the "tremolo arm").”
Andy
#Post#: 1138--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: normj Date: May 27, 2012, 2:59 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Andy,
Hello. My take on it was that Fender did that so he could avoid
being sued. He already ripped off the headstock shape from
Bigsby. If he also called his new bridge a vibrato arm, Bigsby
may have sued him. Easier to call it a tremolo arm. Bigsby never
referred to their unit as a tremolo. And yes it was a misnomer,
but I suspect it was intentionally done for a reason such as
that. Of course, I am just guessing. I have no inside
information. That was the only thing that made any sense to me.
Fender could use vibrato with the amps because Bigsby was not in
that market.
Over the years I have heard all sorts of explanations. Many just
write it off to the fact that Leo did not play guitar and did
not know any better. He seemed like too shrewd a business man
just to have made an uninformed mistake in naming his bridge
unit.
Talk to you later,
Norm
#Post#: 1140--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: abstamaria Date: May 27, 2012, 7:33 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi. Norm,
That's a good, plausible explanation. In any event, it was
Leo's guitar, so he could call it any way he wanted.
Best,
Andy
#Post#: 1141--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: tabalt11 Date: May 27, 2012, 10:38 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Andy- tabalt11 here. Just wanted to THANK YOU for
posting this topic on 'our' forum. As you know it got
more than a fair amount of posts on UF2. Be interesting
getting further perspective here!
#Post#: 1144--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: wstagner Date: May 27, 2012, 11:59 am
---------------------------------------------------------
For me, it's about the functionalty and the look.
The Bigs B was/is a BIG piece of hardware compare to the Fender
approx 1/4" diam rod.
Almost Moseley stylized the Bigsby and tranform it into the
unique arm it was/is on today's Mozrites and Mozrite like
geetars.
The Mozrite was also a pioneer in the dive-bomb-ability
functionalty preseeding Floyd Rose, Kahler, and others.
#Post#: 1145--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato" - this forum
By: abstamaria Date: May 28, 2012, 2:36 am
---------------------------------------------------------
You're welcome, Tabalt1.
I really would like this forum to succeed. There are so many
Shadows sites with so much easily accesible information on the
Shadows - what amps they used, how to sound like them, what
settings to use, and so on - but none on the Ventures. Why is
that?
UF2 is great, but it is hard to access information there, as
threads get buried over time. Also, it seems very focused on
discography and Ventures events, and is a great resource for
that, but there is far less information on guitars, amps, and
playing technique. I wish more of the very knowledgeable
members there would post here as well.
The material and contributions on the Shadows sites are
enormous, but try to Google information on the Ventures gear,
for instance, and I believe you will find very little. There is
certainly no dedicated site, except this fledgling one.
In time, you might want to subdivide your how to sound like the
Ventures into at least 3 sections - Bob Bogle's Jazzmaster
years; Nokie and the Mossrite Era; Gerry McGee's Sound. They
are so different from each other!
Good luck, and best wishes.
Andy
#Post#: 1146--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: tabalt11 Date: May 28, 2012, 8:31 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for the suggestion. Walt might
very well take that into consideration.
#Post#: 1147--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: wstagner Date: May 28, 2012, 9:18 am
---------------------------------------------------------
No need new catgories, Tom.
Just make 3 new topix under "that sound" catgory and sticky
them.
That's EZ.
That's your job 2day, Tom. Makit happn.
#Post#: 1150--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: tabalt11 Date: May 28, 2012, 12:44 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
SLAVE DRIVER- that does it, I'm out. Just kidding!
#Post#: 1153--------------------------------------------------
Re: "Tremolo" versus "Vibrato"
By: wstagner Date: May 28, 2012, 12:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Juss doin ma job. :P
*****************************************************
DIR Next Page