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#Post#: 335--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: Mayclore Date: June 7, 2012, 4:34 pm
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[quote author=Lord Anubis link=topic=7.msg334#msg334
date=1339104610]
Have I ever mentioned I'm really glad we have you around,
Mayclore?
Because I am.[/quote]
If you need something dead, you know who to call.
#Post#: 338--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: PhilSrobeighn Date: June 7, 2012, 7:01 pm
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[quote author=Mayclore link=topic=7.msg335#msg335
date=1339104862]
[quote author=Lord Anubis link=topic=7.msg334#msg334
date=1339104610]
Have I ever mentioned I'm really glad we have you around,
Mayclore?
Because I am.[/quote]
If you need something dead, you know who to call.
[/quote]
Totally glad you're here. Staff Sergeant Carey wouldn't be the
same without you. :D
#Post#: 426--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: PhilSrobeighn Date: June 11, 2012, 3:57 pm
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Are there any key techniques/strategies/phrases/command
structure we should be aware of for a city-wide evacuation?
#Post#: 444--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: Mayclore Date: June 11, 2012, 6:01 pm
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[quote author=Phil Srobeighn link=topic=7.msg426#msg426
date=1339448257]
Are there any key techniques/strategies/phrases/command
structure we should be aware of for a city-wide evacuation?
[/quote]
Hoo boy, I'm gonna need a day or so to research the specifics.
We've got real-world examples (Hurricane Katrina), but I'll need
to look at them.
Basically, the United States Code under the Posse Comitatus Act
(18 USC 1835) does not allow the US Military to perform law
enforcement duties on US soil without Act of Congress or
authority under the Constitution. Local law enforcement would
have to lead otherwise.
I'll have more tomorrow, hopefully.
#Post#: 473--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: Mayclore Date: June 12, 2012, 7:27 pm
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Right. Prepare for a wall of text.
Disasters are handled by what's called the National Response
Framework. We're going to assume that no federal resources will
be in place beforehand, because they don't actually know this is
a disaster yet.
Therefore, at first the problem would be handled by the
Cleveland Division of Police (note that it's not technically
called the police department, even though most everybody does
anyway). I'm guessing they have the usual riot police, SWAT,
that sort of stuff. When overwhelmed, they would go to the
Mayor, who would then appeal to the Governor's office in
Columbus for help. Here's where it gets tricky.
The Governor can issue a state declaration of emergency which
would give them leave to deploy the Ohio National Guard.
Remember that the ONG under the command of the Governor are
considered Title 32 troops, and are not bound by the Posse
Comitatus Act as long as they are under the direct command of
the Governor, meaning they can be used like law enforcement and
arrest people. They are commanded by the Adjutant General of
Ohio, a US Army Major General (two stars). In a larger
emergency, the entire Ohio Organized Militia would be utilized.
This contains:
The Ohio Army National Guard
The Ohio Air National Guard
The Ohio Naval Militia (Not armed, but they have boats. They
patrol Lake Erie's shoreline near Camp Perry, home of the ONG's
training area. Not part of the US Navy Reserve, but they use
Navy ranks and rank insignia.)
The Ohio Military Reserve (Part of the State Defense Forces,
they'd get lumped in with the OArNG.)
This totals about 17,000 personnel. The OArNG and the OAirNG
together are the Ohio National Guard.
Keep in mind that the Adjutant General is in overall command of
all of these, meaning that he/she is basically
Commander-in-Chief for Ohio, answerable to the Governor
him/herself. While the State is in charge, this is as
complicated as it gets. If the Governor asks the President of
the United States to declare a federal emergency, it gets even
worse. The Secretary of Homeland Security will recommend to the
President whether or not a state of emergency should be declared
for that area.
If a federal emergency is granted for rioting, the Insurrection
Act of 1807 will likely be invoked. It states:
Whenever there is an insurrection in any State against its
government, the President may, upon the request of its
legislature or of its governor if the legislature cannot be
convened, call into Federal service such of the militia of the
other States, in the number requested by that State, and use
such of the armed forces, as he considers necessary to suppress
the insurrection.
And further:
Whenever the President considers that unlawful obstructions,
combinations, or assemblages, or rebellion against the authority
of the United States, make it impracticable to enforce the laws
of the United States in any State or Territory by the ordinary
course of judicial proceedings, he may call into Federal service
such of the militia of any State, and use such of the armed
forces, as he considers necessary to enforce those laws or to
suppress the rebellion.
This is how the California National Guard came to be used in a
federal capacity during the L.A. Riots of 1992. They got around
posse comitatus by act of Congress, in this case the
Insurrection Act. Note also that this means the President may
use the National Guards of any state in an attempt to quell
violence. This is not martial law, but is very close.
The final step is martial law, which kicks in under the
Suspension Clause of Article 1 of the Constitution. This means
that habeus corpus (the ability to get out of detention without
cause/sufficient evidence) is thrown out the window, local and
State control is ceded to the Federal Government through the
Department of Homeland Security and the Department of Defense,
and the United States Army -- the Regular Army, the Reserves,
all of it, as well as the Air Force/Marines/Navy if applicable,
are now the givers of law in Cleveland until such time as the
President or Congress says the emergency is ended. United
States Northern Command is the unified combatant command of the
Army responsible for martial law matters. It is headed by a
General (four stars). Remember those military forces under the
command of the Governor? They belong to the President now.
Martial law means curfews, people being shot when not following
directions, and so on; it turns Cleveland into a theater of
operations for the Army. Bear in mind that civilians won't be
killed willy nilly. This is still Ohio. Evacuation comes
first.
If the federal emergency is declared because of 'natural'
disaster, different things happen. The Department of Homeland
Security is still involved, this time through the Federal
Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). FEMA still works with local
authorities to coordinate relief and evacuation efforts, along
with private charities/the Red Cross, etc. Civilian authorities
are still in control, but the ONG may be federalized to assist
them. This is not anywhere near martial law, although force
will be authorized where necessary, such as against looters. If
riots start, see above for what happens.
I'm sorry that was so long. If you have any more specific
questions, ask. I wanted to limit the length of this post and
just hit the basics.
#Post#: 475--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: Lord Anubis Date: June 12, 2012, 8:49 pm
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Damn, that's a very well researched post.
I guess if you want to hit the basics, answer me this: knowing
our plans for what happens to Cleveland, what would be the most
convenient way to set those events in motion?
We want the city to be evacuated at some point.
We want Drew to reenlist somehow.
We want the army stepping into the quarantine zone in an attempt
to contain the invasion.
We want the army to evacuate trapped civilians at the last
second, before the whole city asplodes.
#Post#: 478--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: Mayclore Date: June 12, 2012, 9:14 pm
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[quote author=Lord Anubis link=topic=7.msg475#msg475
date=1339552155]
Damn, that's a very well researched post.
I guess if you want to hit the basics, answer me this: knowing
our plans for what happens to Cleveland, what would be the most
convenient way to set those events in motion?
We want the city to be evacuated at some point.
We want Drew to reenlist somehow.
We want the army stepping into the quarantine zone in an attempt
to contain the invasion.
We want the army to evacuate trapped civilians at the last
second, before the whole city asplodes.
[/quote]
I covered Drew earlier; the Ohio National Guard is his fastest
way in. We have a problem with the last one, as the Army is not
going to wait to evacuate civilians until the last second.
They're going to be chomping at the bit to get them out so they
can start obliterating fluffy ponies. They won't have a chance
to be trapped, because they will be forced to leave just as soon
as possible so the military can do that explody thing they do.
They would probably declare an exclusion zone after fluffy
ponies made the city difficult to live in, i.e. after power
loss, sewage failure. The CDC would advise on this, as disease
would become rampant fast, and would probably kill hundreds of
thousands if the civilians were not made to leave immediately,
which compounds our 'last second escape' problem. I say this
because if a clump of fluffies renders the supply of drinking
water unusable, and people drink that water, they'll get cholera
and dysentery and that is going to be bad. As I said above,
there won't be pre-staged relief supplies because the disaster
is slowly unfolding, and that compounds the issue even further.
#Post#: 480--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: Lord Anubis Date: June 12, 2012, 9:41 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Neckbeard would have to make the stadium evacuation from the
attacking fuzzies take place in the middle of the evacuation,
then. Could that be managed? It's a shame that Drew's finest
moment won't come at the end of Cleveland, but we want to make
it all fit.
But then again, the fuzzies don't escape until Biotoys
evacuates...
How long would it take for the Army to fully evacuate Cleveland
if it was being invaded by millions of fluffy ponies?
Basically, we need some sort of timeframe that gets Biotoys
evacuated at least one or two days before Drew gets to use the
LRAD to make thousands of fuzzies explode at Progressive Field.
#Post#: 492--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: Mayclore Date: June 13, 2012, 10:32 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Lord Anubis link=topic=7.msg480#msg480
date=1339555263]
Neckbeard would have to make the stadium evacuation from the
attacking fuzzies take place in the middle of the evacuation,
then. Could that be managed? It's a shame that Drew's finest
moment won't come at the end of Cleveland, but we want to make
it all fit.
But then again, the fuzzies don't escape until Biotoys
evacuates...
How long would it take for the Army to fully evacuate Cleveland
if it was being invaded by millions of fluffy ponies?
Basically, we need some sort of timeframe that gets Biotoys
evacuated at least one or two days before Drew gets to use the
LRAD to make thousands of fuzzies explode at Progressive Field.
[/quote]
Here's where our problems start. If you consider just the City
of Cleveland, that's 396,815 people; if you take the Greater
Cleveland metropolitan statistical area, which is Cuyahoga,
Geauga, Lake, Lorain, and Medina Counties, that's 2,871,084
people. Having witnessed first hand evacuations from
hurricanes, I can tell you that moving two million people is
hard enough in ideal conditions. What will make it worse is the
fact that this situation is so slowly unfolding. By the time
people realize something is wrong, there could be two or three
fluffies per person in the area...four to six million fuzzballs
and rising.
To figure out how long this would take, we need to have a look
at the Cleveland road system, namely the Interstate Highways.
Interstates were built to facilitate transport of military
equipment; they would no doubt be the Army's preference for
staging and evacuation sendoff points.
HTML http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c6/Cleveland_Interstate_Highways_map.svg/1000px-Cleveland_Interstate_Highways_map.svg.png
Since the city is backed up to Lake Erie, evacuees are going to
be leaving south, east, and west. Interstates 90, 71, and 77
would be the most direct routes out. To achieve faster
evacuation, contraflow would be used, meaning all the lanes of
these Interstates would be going in one direction. This is how
we evacuate the coast when a hurricane comes, and I can tell you
it is utter chaos. The National Guard would probably have to
help the Ohio State Highway Patrol direct traffic. Other cities
along the way (such as Akron) would have to dedicate manpower to
ensuring smooth traffic flow. I can only speculate where
contraflow would end; it would depend on the disaster's scope at
the time of the order.
How bad is contraflow? Look at this:
HTML http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2c/RitaHoustonEvacuation.jpg/800px-RitaHoustonEvacuation.jpg
That occurred during Hurricane Rita. It's highly likely the
OArNG would need to devote a large amount of resources to handle
that mess. Oh, but it gets even worse. Why?
Because the city streets may be rendered impassable by masses of
fluffy ponies. Yes, they're fragile, but if you get enough of
them they're going to get wrapped around driveshafts or shoved
up into engine compartments and god knows what else. You would
probably need high clearance vehicles, or bulldozers, to shove
masses of fluffy ponies aside to clear routes. Cleveland gets
about 62 inches of snow a year, so they have snowplows that
would be effective in this role.
(I promise I'm getting to an answer.)
So you would need to plow fluffies, prepare for contraflow, and
figure out where you can stage the refugees. If the city has
lost power and has no drinking water supply, this becomes
extremely time-sensitive, unless the Air Force and Coast Guard
are going to be dropping in supplies to people on rooftops a la
Hurricane Katrina. That's not very effective. Instead, people
are going to be bussed out. Lots of carpooling. Snowplows
leading the way. If it's too bad, heavy vehicles may be brought
in to part the fluffy herd. Stryker IFVs, M2 Bradleys, anything
that weighs a bunch and can crush a fluffy into a flat, bloody
puddle. Staging refugees is going to be a problem. Ohio is the
tenth most densely populated state. Where are you going to put
them? This will be the biggest thing that affects how long it
takes to evacuate besides conditions.
(See how complicated this is?)
With all that said, I estimate from the point of declaration of
evacuation:
8 to 10 hours to even implement contraflow on the Interstates
(regular traffic must be cleared first)
16 to 24 hours to actually get those evacuees out of Cleveland,
depending on how many decide to leave
Another 12 hours to empty the Interstates and get the Army in to
check for stragglers
A further 12 to 36 hours to sweep the city so extermination
operations may commence
(All this can be altered by the conditions you expect will be
happening, i.e. flooding, inclement weather, civilian
resistance, hordes of fluffies fucking, etc.)
A related note here: United States Army North, also called Fifth
Army, will absolutely be the Army Service Component Command (I'm
sorry for all these military terms) responsible for this
operation. They are the teeth of Northern Command and handle
all operations taking place inside the United States. They are
based at Fort Sam Houston, Texas. They currently have about
270,000 personnel. They are commanded by a Lieutenant General
(three stars).
Now, you can certainly use Progressive Field as a staging point
during the evacuation. It's been done before (the Superdome in
New Orleans). In fact, it would probably be preferred because
it is really close to Interstate 90. Anyway, there you go.
I am seriously sorry that all these posts are so ridiculously
long and boring, I'm just trying to give you an idea of how this
would play out.
#Post#: 494--------------------------------------------------
Re: The Military and You: How I Make Fluffy Explode?
By: PhilSrobeighn Date: June 13, 2012, 11:07 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I am loving every bit of it, Mayclore. It will add a sense of
realism to the entire process.
So if I am reading this correctly, if we give a general
evacuation request due to the Perry Plant problems and the mass
of ferals trying to fight their way to Spaghetti Land, it would
be about a day and a half under normal conditions before we
could have the city blow up without making our story one of
devistating loss of human life. Progressive Field will be used
as a staging area, thus my story with Drew vs. Fluffy 2.0 at
least plausable still?
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