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#Post#: 364--------------------------------------------------
#9: The Dry States
By: TeacherRachel Date: February 26, 2019, 2:25 pm
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Wallace Stegner, "Living Dry," from The American West as Living
Space (pages 206-216)
Joan Didion, "Holy Water," from The White Album (pages 217-221)
Consider:
After the last reading, many of you questioned if it was wrong
to commodify water (clean water should be a right, not a
privilege). Is that still true in a region where water (not
clean water) is scare?
If water's not available naturally, is it wrong to charge for
the privilege of having it unnaturally?
Is it unnatural to bring water to arid places, and people to
places that can't naturally support them? Why or why not?
These are really just starters... go crazy. Ask a question and
answer a question, of course.
#Post#: 365--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: ngood Date: February 26, 2019, 4:13 pm
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Feels weird to be the first to post and to be posting 100% about
death, but hey, life's way too short to worry about stuff like
that.
Water scarcity in the West made me think about the validity of
aquamation as an up-and-coming burial practice. Aquamation
(cremation but with water, basically) understandably requires
water—about the equivalent of a five to ten minute shower, and
the residual liquid can be recycled. I didn’t have time to dig
into a ton of research tonight (because I’m a human being with
other homework and responsibilities), but I wonder what the
difference in attitudes towards aquamation is between the West
and the East Coast. The West is often seen as more “free” and
progressive (though Stegner obviously refutes this) while the
East Coast is seen as more traditional. This might make it seem
like the West would be an ideal place to try out new,
sustainable burial practices, but when you are dealing with
aridity and droughts, how feasible is it to legalize aquamation?
In terms of actual facts, Oregon, Wyoming, and Colorado are the
three Western states (out of the ten US states total) that have
legalized aquamation .
I also wondered how much water embalming (which is unnecessary,
rarely required by law, and, in my opinion, symbolically
distances relatives from the reality of the death of their loved
one by turning them into a wax figure) requires. I found out
that an embalmer would use one gallon of embalming fluid (which
is a mixture of water and preservative chemicals, though I don’t
know the proportions and am sure that they likely differ) for
every fifty pounds of a person’s body weight.
#Post#: 366--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: samfarley Date: February 26, 2019, 6:29 pm
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This reading brought up a number of interesting points, mostly
about how the seemingly worthlessness of land in the west (due
it the arid climate) has impacted how the land has been used.
Most interesting was the role that the government plays in the
west and how water is mostly to blame for it. The government
owns a good amount of the actual land in the west, and has done
so since the earliest days of westward expansion. Because the
government owns most of the land, it also owns a lot of the
water sources and infrastructure. The article describes this
relationship between the people of the west and the government
as a strange one, being that the people dislike feeling
controlled but at the same time are entirely dependant on the
government for their existence in such a climate. This seems to
speak to a mindset that is very American: hating the government
but depending on it at the same time. I’m curious if water is to
blame for starting this mindset. It was also interesting to read
about how the west is seen in a much more transient way, that
people are only there because they are going somewhere else,
that the people who are actually there don’t stay for very long.
The article mentions how this have been dramaticized in
literature, but I wonder how much of an effect this actually had
on sustaining this mindset. If it weren’t for all the writing
and movies romanticizing the west as the ultimate place of
freedom, would many people even live there in the first place,
leading the the problems we have now of water scarcity?
#Post#: 367--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: jbass Date: February 26, 2019, 7:13 pm
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I think there’s a lot of really interesting points that have
been made. I think one very key point is the way that the
government views the land and how much control they have over
the land. It’s really interesting how much of a role the
government plays in all the basic infrastructure of the country.
The role they play is huge because they control all of the land.
Which means they control the economy and that effects the jobs
and it controls agriculture which than effects everyone due to
how many people in the west relied so heavily on farming and the
farm land.
#Post#: 369--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: nanaafiaba Date: February 26, 2019, 7:22 pm
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Though the first reading was fruitful in information, I found
the style of writing to be unengaging and difficult to keep
interested in. Nevertheless, Stegner brings up some intriguing
points. For example, the migratory aspect of the people of the
West makes them unable to truly form the "physical and spiritual
bond" that each and every community has (22). But Western people
do not have a community; they do not plant roots for they must
move repeatedly in order to obtain water and survive. Their
lives are a series of "overnight camps," which is both saddening
and illuminating. In addition, Stegner briefly mentions that
Westerners rarely "stay long enough at one stop to share much of
anything" (23). Since the Westerners do not share information,
Western advancement is therefore inhibited and the situation
remains the same. The West is an example of the consequences of
water being used as a commodity in an area where water is
scarce. The results are preposterous and do not help many if not
any of the people.
Moreover, Didion's piece, which I enjoyed much more than
Stegner's, advanced the points made in "Living Dry." Didion
emphasizes the precious aspect of water and the passion the
Western people have for it. This is fascinating, as we live in
an area where water can be easily accessed so it is difficult to
even imagine a situation resembling this.
What did you guys think about the symbol of the pool? Didion
vaguely explores it but I think there is more to be said about
it.
#Post#: 373--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: nanaafiaba Date: February 26, 2019, 7:37 pm
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To Sam:
I do feel as if there would be much fewer people who emigrated
to the West if not for the romanticization of the land. As
Stegner mentions in "Living Dry," many people came to the West
with a dream. A desire for freedom to live one's life devoid of
social and religious constraints. This dream attracted a number
of people who felt stuck in their lives. Consequently, the
overpopulation of the West, coupled with the scarcity of water,
formulated the enormous water issue in the West that still
exists to this day.
#Post#: 374--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: smartins2019 Date: February 26, 2019, 7:39 pm
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On page 22 of the first reading, I thought it was interesting
how the author was talking about how the west is oftentimes
associated with freedom. “And when teenagers run away these
days, in the belief that they are running toward freedom, they
more often than not run west.” After I read this, I thought
about all the cheesy movies where this happens. Teenagers always
run away from home in attempt to go to California, and adults
wanting a change of scenery move there as well.
In the second part of the reading, at first, I was so surprised
when the author expressed that she has an interest in where her
water comes from. That is something I can pretty confidently say
I have very minimally, if not at all, thought about. This
reading made me think a lot about how much of a privilege it is
to have a constant source of reliably clean water. On another
note, it is also a privilege to be able to find out where your
water comes from and how long it takes to get to you.
Charging for water provided to places where it does not occur
naturally is a tricky thought. Water is something that literally
no one can live without, so in that sense, there is no reason
for people to be charged to have access to it. But on the other
hand, now that I’m thinking about all the effort it takes to
cultivate water, transport it, purify/filter it, and contain/
package it, obviously all that work can’t go without some sort
of commission.
#Post#: 375--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: amacdonald Date: February 26, 2019, 7:52 pm
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I think that in a place where water is not naturally available,
charging people for the privilege of having it is wrong but is
still something that happens. Obviously, if something is rare in
an area, people will be willing to pay more to obtain it. That
does not mean that exploiting this objective truth for profit is
the right thing to do. The thing that struck me in the second
passage was reading about just how much effort and logistic
coordination it takes to move the water from different sources
to Californian cities.
Throughout both readings, I was thinking about the non-natural
aspects of having water moved into places that don’t normally
have an abundance of the resource. The second passage did not
talk much about the environmental effects, but I can’t imagine
that “[storing] roughly a trillion gallons of [water] behind the
Oroville Dam” to be moved into various cities in anywhere near
natural.
My question: should Powell's irrigation proposal have received
more attention from the boosters of the Irrigation Congress of
Los Angeles? Why or why not?
#Post#: 376--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: afreitag Date: February 26, 2019, 8:20 pm
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I'm going to write on Stegner's piece, because Didion's was
honestly unpalatable for me.
I was interested by many of the same points as Sam. I had no
idea that the government owns almost half the land in the
standard western states - but still allows the states to claim
all rights to water in their borders. Even more complicated is
how water is allocated to Native Americans, as all water on
their reservations belong to them but also fall into the rights
of the state's water and there's no specificity. I never even
thought about that issue before.
Is it unnatural to bring water to arid places, and people to
places that can't naturally support them? Why or why not?
I think there's a line in which it becomes unnatural, and that
can be defined by population. Even before there was the
technology for aqueducts and dams in the west, Native Americans
survived in arid areas and later groups of Europeans did too.
However, the rise in population necessitated the advancement of
these water technologies and allowed a larger population, which
then increased to an unsustainable size, which then demands more
unnatural water solutions and use of resources not rightfully
available, and continues on. Naturally, regions of the west can
support human life but only as it would sustain other mammals
that have to adapt to the climate. Small controlled groups of
people that can learn to live responsibly off the land are the
only natural part of humanity in these conditions.
I'd love for someone to disagree with me, if anyone wants to
respond
#Post#: 377--------------------------------------------------
Re: #9: The Dry States
By: Annaliese Date: February 26, 2019, 8:41 pm
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The reading made me realize how many contradictory views there
are surrounding the land in the west. Land in the west is both
seen as a symbol of freedom and yet it is much less valuable
than land in a less arid climate because of its limited access
to water. Defining the west by its inadequate rainfall and
simultaneously noting that farms are concentrated around where
water is plentiful (both points made in the reading) imply that
the land in the west is bad for farming.
I agree with Sof about it being tricky to charge to provide
water. It is an essential resource but also costly to
transport/filter and set up the infrastructure for (pipes,
wells, etc) Ideally, everyone would be able to access it but
that does not come without a cost, especially in arid places.
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