DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
ComeAllWithin (Harlequins Rugby)
HTML https://comeallwithin.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: ComeAllWithin Board
*****************************************************
#Post#: 143790--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: RodneyRegis
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:12 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> This "potential" has been thrown around season after season.
Still haemorrhages massive sums in the name of equality, but hey
if we keep throwing good money after bad maybe it'll eventually
lose £10m a year instead of £12m.
>
> The women's game had the opportunity to learn from pro men's
rugby's mistakes but it seems intent on copying all of them.
With a less appealing sport than men's rugby, it'll likely end
up in a worse position.
>
--- End Quote ---
What, you mean filling stadia by paying millions and millions
for marketing isn't a sustainable business model?
#Post#: 143791--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: Rugbycat
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:16 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> Don't dispute any of that, DOK.
>
> I'm referring to men's rugby as a whole, including
internationals. Plenty of clubs lose money year on year but
that's more due to mismanagement and trying to keep up with the
Joneses in terms of salaries etc. in order to compete in
European competitions and so on. The fact remains that men's
rugby went professional for a reason and there was money to be
made. The interest was there, no shortage of owners willing to
put money into the men's game and the RFU were making vast sums
off the back of international fixtures.
>
--- End Quote ---
But no club is profitable in the prem at present, rugby had been
to all intents professional in the southern hemisphere long
before 1995, which is why the game went professional overnight.
Rugby as a whole includes the women’s game, women are part of
society last time I checked and quite a few attend men’s games.
Your view on professionalism and profit appears to change like
the wind.
#Post#: 143792--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: FrostAndFire
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:24 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> Don't dispute any of that, DOK.
>
> I'm referring to men's rugby as a whole, including
internationals. Plenty of clubs lose money year on year but
that's more due to mismanagement and trying to keep up with the
Joneses in terms of salaries etc. in order to compete in
European competitions and so on. The fact remains that men's
rugby went professional for a reason and there was money to be
made. The interest was there, no shortage of owners willing to
put money into the men's game and the RFU were making vast sums
off the back of international fixtures.
>
--- End Quote ---
That's incoherent. You're arguing men's rugby as a whole is
profitable, but you ignore the vast amounts lost each year,
which is only operable because a few very rich men enjoy having
a toy to spend their fortunes on. None of this is profitable.
You just have people who are willing to take the losses. Arguing
that the women's game has to make a profit is absurd.
#Post#: 143793--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:27 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: RodneyRegis link ---
>
> What, you mean filling stadia by paying millions and millions
for marketing isn't a sustainable business model?
>
--- End Quote ---
Depends how much the tickets are!
#Post#: 143795--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:32 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Rugbycat link ---
>
> But no club is profitable in the prem at present, rugby had
been to all intents professional in the southern hemisphere long
before 1995, which is why the game went professional overnight.
> Rugby as a whole includes the women’s game, women are part of
society last time I checked and quite a few attend men’s games.
> Your view on professionalism and profit appears to change like
the wind.
>
--- End Quote ---
I don't recall denying women being a part of society or rugby.
Rugby is absolutely for everyone. Professional rugby is not. In
the same way it's not for level 5 men's rugby.
#Post#: 143796--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:44 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: FrostAndFire link ---
>
> That's incoherent. You're arguing men's rugby as a whole is
profitable, but you ignore the vast amounts lost each year,
which is only operable because a few very rich men enjoy having
a toy to spend their fortunes on. None of this is profitable.
You just have people who are willing to take the losses. Arguing
that the women's game has to make a profit is absurd.
>
--- End Quote ---
Apart from the bit where I said "plenty of clubs lose money year
on year".....sure, I ignored it..?!
I haven't argued the women's game needs to make a profit - my
argument is that it needs to generate far more money than it
does. It's all the people bleating on about how women's rugby is
the most amazing investment opportunity since Amazon that talk
about all the profit it will make.
International men's rugby is (very) profitable in the UK. Club
rugby isn't, but as you say has enough wealthy owners who want
to back it. The women's game just leeches further off the back
of this. This is why the door is still open for R360 on the
women's side of things, because clubs and unions don't mind the
idea of someone else paying for the women.
But if you look at international rugby in isolation... Men's =
hugely profitable
Women's = money pit
#Post#: 143797--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: Rugbycat
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:52 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> I don't recall denying women being a part of society or rugby.
Rugby is absolutely for everyone. Professional rugby is not. In
the same way it's not for level 5 men's rugby.
>
--- End Quote ---
You need to look at what you are saying, the RFU administers
English rugby which includes women’s rugby, most of rugby leaks
money outside at present the men’s England team, the women’s
team is predicted to make a profit by 2030.
Again your above if taken literally means there should be no
professional men’s clubs as at present every prem club is in the
red.
You can’t separate different strands of rugby schools,
grassroots and women’s and elite and pretend they don’t affect
each other and the men’s national team.
Growing the women’s game will benefit every part of the game and
will be self financing, just saying that we should not invest in
it and instead pay the money to a player who obviously values
financial gain over playing for England seems morally suspect.
A final question why is it acceptable for men’s prem clubs to
run at a loss and not for the Women’s national team to run at a
loss for a few years, and the statement that professional rugby
is not for women, why?.
#Post#: 143798--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: T-Bone
Date: October 19, 2025, 12:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I heard Coventry's chairman speak before their game yesterday.
He certainly doesn't think the RFU are trying to do their best
for the whole game
#Post#: 143800--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: Rugbycat
Date: October 19, 2025, 1:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: T-Bone link ---
>
> I heard Coventry's chairman speak before their game yesterday.
He certainly doesn't think the RFU are trying to do their best
for the whole game
>
--- End Quote ---
I assume it is the same argument that he has been using since
Covid around the prem clubs getting too much and the champ clubs
not enough and about the 10001 capacity for promotion.
He has linked it to the other 1500 clubs in England also not
receiving enough support, he lost the argument effectively in
the vote at the RFU.
#Post#: 143801--------------------------------------------------
Re: Tom Willis off to France again
DIR By: RodneyRegis
Date: October 19, 2025, 1:17 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Rugbycat link ---
>
>
> Again your above if taken literally means there should be no
professional men’s clubs as at present every prem club is in the
red.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
You keep saying that. It's not correct.
*****************************************************
Page 4 of 9
DIR Previous Page
DIR Next Page