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#Post#: 140367--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: Brown Bottle
Date: July 16, 2025, 9:21 am
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--- Quote from: poorfour link ---
>
> I had assumed that if Russell gets injured Marcus would take
the 10 shirt (while covering 15) and Fin or OF would cover from
the bench.
>
--- End Quote ---
I think you might be right, now, but if the plan had ever been
to use Marcus as a starting 10 he would have started there at
least once.
#Post#: 140368--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: BedfordshireBoy
Date: July 16, 2025, 9:23 am
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--- Quote from: FrostAndFire link ---
>
> Did anyone really think Farrell was going to play in this
test? After 20 minutes from the bench?
>
> If Beirne really is in the starting 15, though, that's got to
be reputation only, because he's been **** on tour so far.
>
--- End Quote ---
You know who did.
#Post#: 140375--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: Yareet
Date: July 17, 2025, 2:07 am
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Marcus now confirmed as 22 in a
5:3 bench
#Post#: 140377--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: JammyGit
Date: July 17, 2025, 2:51 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: poorfour link ---
>
> I had assumed that if Russell gets injured Marcus would take
the 10 shirt (while covering 15) and Fin or OF would cover from
the bench.
>
--- End Quote ---
I think they'd keep him on the bench. If they thought he was a
live option to start a match at 10 they'd have given him that
opportunity at any point on tour...
Beirne has been absolutely awful, Incredible that he's been
selected. Australia are bad so it probably won't matter but it
looks like that back row was picked the moment Doris got
injured.
#Post#: 140378--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: PinguthePenQuin
Date: July 17, 2025, 2:52 am
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I think it seemed clear from the outset, that AF saw Russell as
his starting 10 with Marcus his closest replacement in terms of
style.
There were (still are) lots of people surprised Marcus made the
tour, but I wouldn't have been surprised if AF told Marcus that
a bench spot was always going to be his role.
Firstly, he can cover 10/15 but also, if Russell does go off
injured and Marcus steps in, the gameplan doesn't change.
Whereas with FS, it would. In an odd way, it kind of reverses
the England 10 issue. The way England play suits FS whereas the
way the Lions play better suits MS.
#Post#: 140384--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: Rugbycat
Date: July 17, 2025, 4:21 am
---------------------------------------------------------
AF had picked this line up long ago, when he selected the squad.
the only changes are because of injuries, in the same way that
the playing style was always going to be what it is.
The australians are going to struggle against the Lions
forwards, and only have an edge in the pace of their backs, and
have a very average 9, and Tom Lynagh at 10 has played an hour
at test level.
The Lions need to implode to lose, and the bench when it comes
on will add pace to the Lions forwards, you could get a squirrel
from richmond park to coach the Lions and they would still win.
The squirrel might even have selected on form and not played a
pseudo Irish style, and not be showing the non irish players how
to beat Irelands system.
More interested the England match, Lions tours are great for
fans if you are there in person, but from home you are just
watching a coach pick his pet players and play their style,
where the result is less than the sum of the talents of the
players.
#Post#: 140386--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: Banstead Quin
Date: July 17, 2025, 5:01 am
---------------------------------------------------------
So pretty much as thought then:-
Keenan, Freeman, Jones, Tuipulotu, Lowe, Russell, Gibson-Park;
Genge, Sheehan, Furlong. Itoje, McCarthy, Beirne, Curry, Conan.
Replacements: Kelleher, Porter, Stuart, Chessum, Earl, Mitchell,
M Smith, Aki
Surprised Genge over Porter. Not form related, just because the
Irish connection. Also thought Bealham would squeak the bench.
Lot's re Curry above. Chessum unlucky but do I honestly thing
Beirne wouldn't start????
Re Fazlet, i wonder if he'll start on Tuesday at 10, depending
on how Saturday goes? If the Lions win well then he'll probably
bench against the first nations. If Russell has one of those
games, like he did against England, then the panic might set in
they'll want Fazlet battle ready.
#Post#: 140387--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: Banstead Quin
Date: July 17, 2025, 5:07 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Championship Guy link ---
>
> I think it seemed clear from the outset, that AF saw Russell
as his starting 10 with Marcus his closest replacement in terms
of style.
> There were (still are) lots of people surprised Marcus made
the tour, but I wouldn't have been surprised if AF told Marcus
that a bench spot was always going to be his role.
> Firstly, he can cover 10/15 but also, if Russell does go off
injured and Marcus steps in, the gameplan doesn't change.
Whereas with FS, it would. In an odd way, it kind of reverses
the England 10 issue. The way England play suits FS whereas the
way the Lions play better suits MS.
>
--- End Quote ---
Yet perversely, England played more to Marcus' strength's in the
two games v Argentina. The only difference was when Ford put in
his aerial bombs and territory kicks in the last quarter, when
you'd normally have the replacement coming on to close out the
game, which is more F Smith. Of course, Blackett won't be
involved in the autumn unless Borethick see's that his mate is
too negative in game plan.
#Post#: 140393--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: Yareet
Date: July 17, 2025, 7:50 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Banstead Quin link ---
>
> Yet perversely, England played more to Marcus' strength's in
the two games v Argentina. The only difference was when Ford put
in his aerial bombs and territory kicks in the last quarter,
when you'd normally have the replacement coming on to close out
the game, which is more F Smith. Of course, Blackett won't be
involved in the autumn unless Borethick see's that his mate is
too negative in game plan.
>
--- End Quote ---
Hang on.
So, in your opinion, the way England played v Argentina better
suits Marcus than Fin and that's because it's a different attack
coach than normal.
But England won't continue to play that way in the Autumn
because Wigglesworth will come back in from his role as attack
coach for the Lions. Who also play in a style more suited to
Marcus than Fin.
#Post#: 140395--------------------------------------------------
Re: Marcus on the bench for the first Lions test
DIR By: RodneyRegis
Date: July 17, 2025, 8:11 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Rugbycat link ---
>
> AF had picked this line up long ago, when he selected the
squad. the only changes are because of injuries, in the same way
that the playing style was always going to be what it is.
>
> The australians are going to struggle against the Lions
forwards, and only have an edge in the pace of their backs, and
have a very average 9, and Tom Lynagh at 10 has played an hour
at test level.
>
> The Lions need to implode to lose, and the bench when it comes
on will add pace to the Lions forwards, you could get a squirrel
from richmond park to coach the Lions and they would still win.
>
> The squirrel might even have selected on form and not played a
pseudo Irish style, and not be showing the non irish players how
to beat Irelands system.
>
> More interested the England match, Lions tours are great for
fans if you are there in person, but from home you are just
watching a coach pick his pet players and play their style,
where the result is less than the sum of the talents of the
players.
>
--- End Quote ---
Correct.
Lions tours are generally ruined by national coaches. It's only
natural for a guy like AF to pick a guy like beirne who has been
in the trenches with him through thick and thin.
Same reason why national coaches should not come from clubs, and
why they should never have more than 2 years in charge. Players
should be able to break into the national side without relying
on injuries.
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