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#Post#: 130114--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: Quinky
Date: November 11, 2024, 4:09 pm
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--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> Kwagga Smith is an absolute animal. This isn't the argument
you think it is 😂
>
--- End Quote ---
I guess Cheslin Kolbe is too small to play international rugby
too.
The problem with pigeonholing players is that you don't allow
for outliers. Power is relevant, and would be even more so in a
one against one situation. But the back row plays as a unit.
Neil Back was for a long time considered too small, but he did
ok. Not so long ago, Fin Baxter dominated a vastly larger and
more powerful opponent.
For the record, there are many different ways to measure power.
#Post#: 130115--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: November 11, 2024, 4:21 pm
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--- Quote from: Quinky link ---
>
> I guess Cheslin Kolbe is too small to play international rugby
too.
>
> The problem with pigeonholing players is that you don't allow
for outliers. Power is relevant, and would be even more so in a
one against one situation. But the back row plays as a unit.
Neil Back was for a long time considered too small, but he did
ok. Not so long ago, Fin Baxter dominated a vastly larger and
more powerful opponent.
>
> For the record, there are many different ways to measure
power.
>
--- End Quote ---
No...but Cheslin Kolbe is definitely too small to play
international rugby as an openside flanker.
Neil Back played in an entirely different era. The game isn't
comparable to today's.
Baxter is a prop. You can mitigate for lack of power with
excellent technique and overall strength. But I'd also add that
I think Baxter is pretty powerful.
You can measure power in a few ways, but by delusion isn't one
of them!
#Post#: 130117--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: Quinky
Date: November 11, 2024, 9:03 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> No...but Cheslin Kolbe is definitely too small to play
international rugby as an openside flanker.
>
> Neil Back played in an entirely different era. The game isn't
comparable to today's.
>
> Baxter is a prop. You can mitigate for lack of power with
excellent technique and overall strength. But I'd also add that
I think Baxter is pretty powerful.
>
> You can measure power in a few ways, but by delusion isn't one
of them!
>
--- End Quote ---
You think Wev isn't good enough for international rugby due to
lack of power. Fair enough. I disagree. I think he's got
attributes that more than make up for any perceived lack of
power.
Then again, you support a team that apparently values power over
talent, ability and performance. I support a team who pick
players on merit. My team are back to back current world
champions. How's your team's approach serving them?
#Post#: 130120--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: deadlyfrom5yardsout
Date: November 12, 2024, 2:56 am
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Shrinky, I'll have you know that our team are highly successful
at back to back under achievements.
Also, if size is the issue, surely the ideal game to blood young
WEv on the international stage is versus the Honourable Cherry
Blossoms?
#Post#: 130123--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: Mayor West
Date: November 12, 2024, 4:01 am
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Why are the other players selected for England . The ones
playing in exactly the same league against the same teams with
the same players who don’t manage to achieve the same stats as
Will. Surely if you are comparing 7s, the best one is the one
with the highest results.
#Post#: 130125--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: Quinky
Date: November 12, 2024, 4:24 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Mayor West link ---
>
> Why are the other players selected for England . The ones
playing in exactly the same league against the same teams with
the same players who don’t manage to achieve the same stats as
Will. Surely if you are comparing 7s, the best one is the one
with the highest results.
>
--- End Quote ---
You'd think so. But apparently not. Wev's opponents, whom he
runs rings around every week, get an England shirt and suddenly
develop super powers. Well, power anyway. The same power that's
woefully ineffective against him when they play Quins.
#Post#: 130127--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: never sleep
Date: November 12, 2024, 5:07 am
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One of my frustrations when watching England play is that often
the forwards make no attempt to challenge at the breakdown.
Challenging at the breakdown carries risk in that you can give
away penalties. WEv does concede a fair number.
From what I see, England prefers to hold back and hope that the
opposition will either knock-on or box kick.
This means that the only way that we get a ball for the backs to
play with is either from a scrum or from catching a high ball.
I don't see that WEv (and Dommers) fit in with this sort of
gameplan.
#Post#: 130131--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: November 12, 2024, 6:58 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Quinky link ---
>
> You think Wev isn't good enough for international rugby due to
lack of power. Fair enough. I disagree. I think he's got
attributes that more than make up for any perceived lack of
power.
>
> Then again, you support a team that apparently values power
over talent, ability and performance. I support a team who pick
players on merit. My team are back to back current world
champions. How's your team's approach serving them?
>
--- End Quote ---
I think Evans has fantastic attributes. I'm saying lack of
power/dynamism is why he doesn't and won't get picked.
South Africa are back to back world champions purely because
they are the most powerful team on the planet. They have skills
and talented players, no denying that. But their sheer power is
what sets them apart from other countries.
#Post#: 130132--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: November 12, 2024, 7:00 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: deadlyfrom5yardsout link ---
>
> Shrinky, I'll have you know that our team are highly
successful at back to back under achievements.
>
> Also, if size is the issue, surely the ideal game to blood
young WEv on the international stage is versus the Honourable
Cherry Blossoms?
>
--- End Quote ---
Yes, I'd agree. But if you won't use him in games V SA,
Argentina, ABs etc. what's the point. Need to have confidence in
him in any scenario and they clearly don't.
#Post#: 130133--------------------------------------------------
Re: Will Evans > Pro D2
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: November 12, 2024, 7:08 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Mayor West link ---
>
> Why are the other players selected for England . The ones
playing in exactly the same league against the same teams with
the same players who don’t manage to achieve the same stats as
Will. Surely if you are comparing 7s, the best one is the one
with the highest results.
>
--- End Quote ---
It's too simplistic a view. Premiership rugby is not
international rugby. There is more time and space in club rugby,
so while X flanker may not steal ball as well as Evans or make
as many tackles... X flanker might make few passive tackles,
carry more effectively etc. It's undeniable that the best
international rugby sides are the ones with the most power, not
the best ball stealer. There are far fewer chances to steal the
ball at international level than at club level, which then takes
one of Evans' main skill sets and reduces his effectiveness even
before kick off.
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