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#Post#: 116302--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: December 1, 2023, 7:10 am
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--- Quote from: Yareet link ---
>
> FWIW, I'm not sure we would have all of this second guessing
for many other players. I can't imagine a similar reaction had
it been (for example) Lawes.
>
> McCall has come out and cited the abuse Farrell gets as the
reason. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't do if there was a hidden
agenda. For me, we therefore have to be prepared to accept that
there isn't another cause. And the fact that Farrell is renowned
for being so keen to play for England should be a stronger
argument for how deeply he has been suffering.
>
> Comparing one person's mental health decisions to another's
is a red herring. We have no idea what any player has been
through nor what impact that has on their wellbeing.
>
> Although I am tempted to agree that any player would be less
likely to voluntarily stand down in a World Cup or Lions year.
>
--- End Quote ---
Absolutely, can't disagree with your post. However, not being
candid about it only fuels speculation. So whilst I've got my
opinion, I'm completely open to being proven wrong.
#Post#: 116304--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: Marsile
Date: December 1, 2023, 8:07 am
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--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> Absolutely, can't disagree with your post. However, not being
candid about it only fuels speculation. So whilst I've got my
opinion, I'm completely open to being proven wrong.
>
--- End Quote ---
Your hubris is remarkable.
#Post#: 116306--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: Fearless Fred
Date: December 1, 2023, 8:37 am
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HTML https://media0.giphy.com/media/jsCnmU8EJDuow/200.gif
#Post#: 116307--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: QuincyJones
Date: December 1, 2023, 9:04 am
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--- Quote from: Marsile link ---
>
>
>
> Your hubris is remarkable.
>
--- End Quote ---
I'm not sure you know what hubris means.
I've got an opinion based entirely on what I have seen and heard
of/from/about Owen Farrell since day dot. But as already stated,
I could well be totally wrong. The reason I have an opinion at
all is because there has been little candour from Farrell - as
is his right.
#Post#: 116308--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: Yareet
Date: December 1, 2023, 9:11 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> Absolutely, can't disagree with your post. However, not being
candid about it only fuels speculation. So whilst I've got my
opinion, I'm completely open to being proven wrong.
>
--- End Quote ---
I'm not sure it does - or rather that it should.
Other players have taken mental health breaks and I don't
remember any speculation. When Michael Hooper took time out last
year, the overriding opinion seemed to be that he was brave for
admitting that he needed time away from the sport.
I am also very conscious that anyone's view of how people
(should?) react to a situation like this will be coloured by
their own instincts. If the lack of candour leads you to
speculate as to what else is not being said, I can understand
that you would feel that this is the normal POV.
Personally (and perhaps naively), I tend to take what I'm told
at face value. We know that Farrell is a divisive figure and
receives more criticism than most players. For me, it therefore
isn't much of a leap to suggest that the abuse he (and his
family) gets may have taken it's toll. Or he fears it may do.
Under those circumstances, there is therefore no need for there
to be a hidden, deeper cause. There may not even be one cause;
rather an accumulation of tiny incidents that have built up over
time.
However, I do appreciate that more questioning minds will be
less trusting in the absence of any further evidence.
Ultimately, we have a man who has given up doing something he
(by all accounts) loves and cares deeply about for the sake of
his and his family's health. Seemingly, the cause is the actions
of others. Whether that is media criticism, abuse from fans or
something more sinister is for me less relevant than the fact
that even somebody as supposedly confident and mentally strong
as Farrell has apparently been pushed too close to the brink.
Farrell will never see what is written on this board so our
comments are largely immaterial. Of greater impact will be what
is written and said in the public media. And that's where I can
see that speculation as to the "true reason" for his decision
could be construed as further adding to the mental strain.
The guy can't even say that he's had enough without people
guessing as to why!
#Post#: 116309--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: JammyGit
Date: December 1, 2023, 9:58 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Yareet link ---
>
> I'm not sure it does - or rather that it should.
>
> Other players have taken mental health breaks and I don't
remember any speculation. When Michael Hooper took time out last
year, the overriding opinion seemed to be that he was brave for
admitting that he needed time away from the sport.
>
--- End Quote ---
I think you're missing the fact it's about Farrell's family's
mental health as well. It makes sense that the highest profile
player in the England game suddenly calling it quits months away
from the 6N with a very terse statement released through a 3rd
party, where the reason given is to prioritise not just his but
his family's mental well-being, would lead to speculation. It
does change the angle a bit.
Hooper realised his head wasn't in the right place to go through
with the tour and said exactly that.
#Post#: 116310--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: Yareet
Date: December 1, 2023, 10:11 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: JammyGit link ---
>
> I think you're missing the fact it's about Farrell's family's
mental health as well. It makes sense that the highest profile
player in the England game suddenly calling it quits months away
from the 6N with a very terse statement released through a 3rd
party, where the reason given is to prioritise not just his but
his family's mental well-being, would lead to speculation. It
does change the angle a bit.
>
> Hooper realised his head wasn't in the right place to go
through with the tour and said exactly that.
>
>
>
--- End Quote ---
Sorry Jams, I was in the middle of editing my post so I do
mention his family more now.
#Post#: 116311--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: Marsile
Date: December 1, 2023, 10:14 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuincyJones link ---
>
> I'm not sure you know what hubris means.
>
> I've got an opinion based entirely on what I have seen and
heard of/from/about Owen Farrell since day dot. But as already
stated, I could well be totally wrong. The reason I have an
opinion at all is because there has been little candour from
Farrell - as is his right.
>
--- End Quote ---
I'll indulge you. What is this incredible insight you have
witnessed, seen and heard about the life of Owen Farrell that
supports your opinion over somebody like Mark McCall perhaps?
#Post#: 116314--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: JammyGit
Date: December 1, 2023, 10:31 am
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--- Quote from: Yareet link ---
>
> Sorry Jams, I was in the middle of editing my post so I do
mention his family more now.
>
--- End Quote ---
Cheers.
The "seemingly" bit is basically the nub and the cause of the
speculation. You can take what he said at face value while still
wondering what actually did the damage, because he didn't say
anything to that effect, and instead we're reliant on 3rd
parties giving it both barrels over a wide range of topics
(including McCall, who made a reference to the threats that
referees have received, something I mentioned before - although
he did then try and make out that Farrell has suffered for
longer than Wayne Barnes, which is a little silly given that
Barnes has been a figure of extreme hatred to some since that
2007 game, but I digress)
Again I must stress that no blame or criticism is implied for
his lack of explanation, it's entirely in keeping with his
desire to protect himself and his family, and by all accounts
he's a very private man in that regard.
#Post#: 116316--------------------------------------------------
Re: Farrell taking a break from International rugby
DIR By: Bolly-Quin
Date: December 1, 2023, 10:40 am
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Didn't McCall also suggest that no other English captains had
had this degree of "cancelling" before - tell that to the
numerous football and cricket team members that have been
vilified far more seriously in the press in the last 20-30
years. Robshaw got a heaps poured on him while English captain.
Seems McCall has either a short term memory or a selective one.
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