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#Post#: 12703--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: Everyone’s a Quinner Date: December 18, 2018, 2:17 pm
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[quote author=BedfordshireBoy link=topic=616.msg12669#msg12669
date=1545131482]
Seem to recall the Brexiteers propaganda machine were telling us
negotiating trade deals should take a matter of a few weeks.
[/quote]
I swear I remember seeing something that discussions with other
countries outside of the EU such as NZ, Canada and the US to
name a few happened months ago but I could be wrong
#Post#: 12704--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: Everyone’s a Quinner Date: December 18, 2018, 2:19 pm
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[quote author=alexfromlondon link=topic=616.msg12678#msg12678
date=1545137497]
“Freedom to trade” ?
Is this not one of the big Brexit myths that has been busted? We
already globally trade under eu negotiated deals. Brexit will
restrict our global opportunities whilst we deal with the
uncertainty as to what extent these deals may be replaced?
[/quote]
Your point about already trading globally maybe so but leaving
the eu gives us more freedom, not less.
#Post#: 12712--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: guest257 Date: December 18, 2018, 3:03 pm
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[quote author=Everyone’s a Quinner
link=topic=616.msg12704#msg12704 date=1545164357]
Your point about already trading globally maybe so but leaving
the eu gives us more freedom, not less.
[/quote]
How exactly? What countries do you foresee that we will boost
our trade with through a preferential arrangement to the one we
currently have? And to what extent will that exceed the trade we
lose through cutting ourselves adrift from our biggest market?
What jobs might these deals create to replace the ones that
might be lost due to lack of single European market access?
Would love to hear a positive spin. But sadly there’s no
economic argument for leaving.
#Post#: 12723--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: Date: December 18, 2018, 7:58 pm
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[quote author=alexfromlondon link=topic=616.msg12712#msg12712
date=1545167027]
How exactly? What countries do you foresee that we will boost
our trade with through a preferential arrangement to the one we
currently have? And to what extent will that exceed the trade we
lose through cutting ourselves adrift from our biggest market?
What jobs might these deals create to replace the ones that
might be lost due to lack of single European market access?
Would love to hear a positive spin. But sadly there’s no
economic argument for leaving.
[/quote]
I, like you Alex, do not hold all of the answers. These things
come with time. You can’t predict either way how worse or better
off we will be. Anyone who tells you our world in the UK is
going to cave in is spouting out utter fear mongering nonsense,
much the same for people who can somehow give dead certain
assurances (at this stage) we will do better off. What I can
say is what I said above which is so clear; be free of the EU
means less constraints to how we trade and who with. It’s
obvious. One less leache holding us back. I can see us striking
deals with many countries. It’s all about our country having a
backbone in this process and having faith in ourselves and our
country. We are leaving, now we must all bind together more than
ever and do what’s best for our country in these circumstances.
What doesn’t help is the mainstream media choosing what they
report to sway the general publics knowledge with one sided
views and cloaking the other side of things, the Gary Linekers
who really should stick to their day jobs, a number of the big
money business bosses who seem to be afraid of Brexit in more
personal terms than what it means to our country and the select
group of Remainers who haven’t and can’t let go of the result a
democratic decision. I neither like or loath Piers Morgan for
example but he makes a grown up point. He wanted Remain but
believes both in democracy and since Leave won the vote we
should as a country get behind it, pull together no matter what
side of the fence we did sit on or still do, unify and make the
best of what we can. The lack of spirit some people/media
outlets show does not help. We are spineless and need to find
our bite again.
We are in such a strong position if we left with no deal. If
someone punches you, you punch twice as hard. For instance if
the EU wants to charge us £6 to visit the EU, great we will
charge them £12 to visit us. They’ll soon change their minds.
Don’t tell me they won’t because Europe as a business and as a
tourism perspective will always want links with the UK. If we
let the EU keep punching us and we don’t stick up for ourselves
who will, and why would the EU stop. They are doing it for them,
not for us remember! Don’t let people bully you, it took me
years to learn that growing up and the same applies here. It
really does. A great number of my European friends agree that it
is quite honestly disgusting how our country, our PM (whether
you like her or not, she needs to be shown respect by the EU),
our government and our people are being treated. They too agree
that we should be sticking up for ourselves more and that we
really don’t seem to be expressing much believe or faith in our
country or it’s people, and that we should be much more
headstrong.
It’s so clear in the water, these coming days you can see
members of the European Parliament starting to quake in their
boots. It’s written all over Guy Verhofstadt, Jean-Claude and
others faces, you can see it in their behaviour, body language,
what they say, what they tweet. They can see the storm coming
and the nation getting fed up, we don’t want to be shafted and
we can smell a bad deal when one is presented and we are getting
fed up of being bullied by the EU. Enough is enough and as we as
the people’s of the UK are starting to show this, European
Parliaments fear grows. If we leave with no deal, we save £39
billion. We would be a free trader much like New Zealand,
Australia, Singapore, Canada to name a few. We can pretty much
tear up tariffs and taxes on non EU imports, regain control of
our fishing almost immediately. The taxes on these goods go
straight to the EU. We will become better off as UK people by
getting rid of these taxes and tarrifs by leaving the EU. Yet
more money saved.
The European Parliament see this and they do not like it, not
one bit, and are trying to put us off leaving on WTO terms as
much as possible. And they make out as though this is the best
deal which it is no where near a good one. It really baffles me
seeing as we are in a much better position. If we leave on WTO
terms they will come running afterwards for our business. It is
a given. And once we do so you will see more countries in Europe
wanting to follow suit. Italy, Hungary, Holland are already
liking the idea of leaving, the people of France are finding
their voices slowly but surely and are coming to realise how low
Europe is sinking, and believe me it is sinking. As are the
people of Spain, Portugal and Greece. New Zealand, Australia,
Canada, Singapore are counties on WTO schemes and free trade who
demonstrate good democracy and in turn have great economies.
Let’s join them. The same can’t be said for much of Europe.
That’s what I can tell you Alex. Our country has become too
“politically correct” in recent years and too spineless. We need
to stand up for ourselves, we are in a much better position than
Europe and they need us a heck of a lot more than we need them.
We leave with no deal and you watch... they will be biting at
our ankles afterwards joining the queue of other countries
wishing to do so. And we will not forget the way our country,
it’s government and it’s people have been treated by the EU in
all of this.
A big problem with this whole situation is many people’s
perception which isn’t helped by the media being so biased and
amplifying a one sided story. Many of our country’s people
perceive this whole thing rather wrongly. “Give it to me now”
... “Show me now”, people won’t believe something until they see
it and unfortunately that can’t always be the case. We need to
snap out of this weakness and believe in ourselves, take this
big leap of faith and then we will see what will happen. I am
not a fortune teller but what I have faith in is our great
country and it’s amazing people, our history of willingness to
pull through, work hard and go into things positively and
headstrong. Believe in something and show trust in ourselves,
that is a big factor in what has historically made us successful
and what I believe will make us successful!
Let’s keep positive, show some fighting spirit and do the
business! Mange Tout, Mange Tout
#Post#: 12732--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: guest257 Date: December 19, 2018, 3:08 am
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I think, fundamentally, I can’t agree on a couple of key areas.
And maybe this sums up where the country is divided:
1) Europe holds us back in trade opportunities - it doesn’t, it
creates opportunities (see the Japan, Canada and South Korea
deals)
2) They need is more than we need them - they don’t (just look
at the numbers - there are a lot more of them than us)
3) It’ll be ok if we just believe - it won’t (we need people to
engage with the technical detail and challenge - the ignorance
about what the Eu is and how it operates from the public, media
and politicians is flabbergasting)
#Post#: 12741--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: Everyone’s a Quinner Date: December 19, 2018, 3:53 am
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This is also a good read regarding trade and EU etc
HTML https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/apr/08/why-the-uk-trade-deficit-with-the-eu-is-woeful-and-widening
#Post#: 12744--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: deadlyfrom5yardsout Date: December 19, 2018, 4:19 am
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Troops on the Ground! Don't back us into a corner!
#Post#: 12797--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: guest257 Date: December 19, 2018, 2:14 pm
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Here is an excellent article. It’s a bucket of cold water in the
face of some of the fantasy garbage being spouted by many on
both sides.
But in short, make no mistake about it - Brexit is going to be
hard, time consuming, costly, make us poorer and give us much
less global influence than we enjoy now (IMO!)
HTML https://news.liverpool.ac.uk/2018/12/13/full-speech-sir-ivan-rogers-on-brexit/
#Post#: 12800--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: BedfordshireBoy Date: December 19, 2018, 2:51 pm
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Have a listen to this, No Deal Brexit bit is sixty minutes into
the programme.
HTML https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p06rhy1l
#Post#: 12820--------------------------------------------------
Re: Brexit
By: deadlyfrom5yardsout Date: December 20, 2018, 4:18 am
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69 minutes....
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