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#Post#: 82524--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: JammyGit
Date: January 19, 2022, 4:09 am
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--- Quote from: deadlyfrom5yardsout link ---
>
> Sam Simmons and Barbeary are similar players I think so
assuming Dommers starts they will have to alternate maybe?
>
--- End Quote ---
Not sure they're that similar - Barbeary's work at the breakdown
is a big part of his game, Simmonds has pace to burn, etc. But
they're similar in one very important respect, which is that
neither of them are lineout targets which reduces Eddie's
options.
I could definitely see Eddie trying to shoehorn in Barbeary at 7
at some point.
#Post#: 82528--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: PinguthePenQuin
Date: January 19, 2022, 4:26 am
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The BBC Rugby Podcast had an additional episode this week -
interviewing EJ after the squad announcement (sadly it was Matt
Dawson rather than Danny Care on it). Jones specifically
mentions Smith at 10 with Farrell at 12 as an established player
calling the shots.
When asked if Farrell needed gametime first, Jones said he (Faz)
is playing this weekend.
Dawson asked how long does Farrell have credit in the bank and
in fairness to Jones, he alluded to this tournament using that
credit and future selection will be based on form and fitness.
#Post#: 82529--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: Quinten Poulsen
Date: January 19, 2022, 4:41 am
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I sincerely hope Eddie doesn't pick a forward at 12.
#Post#: 82532--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: Man From LA
Date: January 19, 2022, 4:56 am
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--- Quote from: poorfour link ---
>
> Interesting. How is Simmonds' distribution? I guess it's not
as if Manus is known for his kicking and passing but to be
effective Simmonds would have to match that.
>
> Eddie has also spoken of wanting Farrell at 12 to "manage the
game" for Marcus, presumably leaving him free to make and find
the space (the same division of labour that Danny and Marcus
have here), which obviously wouldn't work with Simmonds (or
Manu). I am not sure I can see that move as more than a last
quarter tactical shift, at least in the short term. (Though
oddly, I would have loved to see them do that with a fully fit
Clifford, who definitely did have the distribution).
>
--- End Quote ---
Smithy seemed to manage the game against the world champions
well enough without Farrell holding his hand, it's just
patronising guff from Jones rather than admit he doesn't want to
drop his golden child.
#Post#: 82539--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: TomBuckQuin
Date: January 19, 2022, 6:01 am
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--- Quote from: Quinten Poulsen link ---
>
> I sincerely hope Eddie doesn't pick a forward at 12.
>
--- End Quote ---
Yeah, whilst the idea of a Simmonds or Barbeary punching holes
in defences from 12 is fun on the face of it, they'll be exposed
defensively time and time again. 12 and 13 are often defensive
leaders for a reason and as smart a player as Simmonds is, it
would be a lot to ask of him to learn a whole new defensive role
from scratch at international level.
#Post#: 82542--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: Monte
Date: January 19, 2022, 6:12 am
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--- Quote from: Man From LA link ---
>
> Smithy seemed to manage the game against the world champions
well enough without Farrell holding his hand, it's just
patronising guff from Jones rather than admit he doesn't want to
drop his golden child.
>
--- End Quote ---
If you listen to Squidge he says DC manages our games not
Marcus. In fact when you have absorbed that and then watch Quins
play he is largely right.
#Post#: 82543--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: MaidstoneQuin
Date: January 19, 2022, 6:29 am
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Based on the squad picked, excluding any late fitness challenges
with Manu, Underhill etc..
1. Marler
2. LCD
3. Sinkler
4. Itoje
5. Hill
6. Lawes (On his last performances hes done well here so
inclined to keep him)
7. Curry
8. Dommers
9. Quirke
10. Smith
11. Malins
12. Slade
13. Marchant
14. Nowell (I'd personally have Radwan if in the squad)
15. Steward
However, I imagine the reality for the backs in particular Jones
will go
9. Youngs
10 Smith
11 May
12 Farrell
13 Slade
14. Marchant
15 Steward
#Post#: 82545--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: Twickersman
Date: January 19, 2022, 6:50 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Would Andre Esterhauzen be a foward or back if he was brought
through the English system. My thinking is that he would be made
a forward and back row.
The likes of Sam Simmonds could defo work at 12.
Centers never pass to each other anymore, or so Eddie says. So
you need athletes in all positions.
We lack a Esterhuizan type centre, we just do not produce them
unless you count Tuilangi, who was an import and pretty
exceptional.
Perhaps they are all playing back row.
#Post#: 82546--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: RhubarbAndGustard
Date: January 19, 2022, 7:17 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Twickersman link ---
>
> Would Andre Esterhauzen be a foward or back if he was brought
through the English system. My thinking is that he would be made
a forward and back row.
>
--- End Quote ---
Jake White tried to make Esterhuizen a back row, he gave it a go
but ultimately refused as he wanted to be a centre. Now he’s one
of the best 12s in the world.
Barbeary was also a centre through the age grades. A few months
back a someone asked him if he saw himself as a hooker or back
row, and he said a 12.
I think there’s definitely a case that back row and centres
could be interchangeable - just look at Sam Burgess’ time in
union.
#Post#: 82547--------------------------------------------------
Re: England Squad announced
DIR By: TomBuckQuin
Date: January 19, 2022, 7:18 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Twickersman link ---
>
> Would Andre Esterhauzen be a foward or back if he was brought
through the English system. My thinking is that he would be made
a forward and back row.
>
> The likes of Sam Simmonds could defo work at 12.
>
> Centers never pass to each other anymore, or so Eddie says. So
you need athletes in all positions.
>
> We lack a Esterhuizan type centre, we just do not produce them
unless you count Tuilangi, who was an import and pretty
exceptional.
>
> Perhaps they are all playing back row.
>
--- End Quote ---
I actually think you're spot on that there probably have been
potential English answers to Esterhuizen that have ended up in
the back row - but asking an 8 to switch to 12 at international
level is, in my mind, more likely to be an unmitigated disaster
than a stroke of genius, particularly with defence in mind as I
mentioned above.
It does feel like there has been a breakthrough in thinking
around the merits of a proper unit at 12 (who doesn't neglect
skills training) in recent seasons though and I'm hopeful we'll
see some meaty centres with a well-developed all round game
coming through Prem academy pipelines in the next few years. I'm
excited to see how Lennox Anyanwu develops for us in
particular...
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