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#Post#: 73114--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: raedarius
Date: August 14, 2021, 3:41 am
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--- Quote from: Fursty link ---
>
> Genuine question - why is that?
>
--- End Quote ---
Nobody's created a Wikipedia page for them yet.
Go on, you know you want to...
#Post#: 73118--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: Mayor West
Date: August 14, 2021, 4:59 pm
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I thought the Claxton brothers were builders. They were mostly
resident in the Nelson in Whitton when I used to frequent the
same establishment in the early eighties.
#Post#: 73130--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: Somardino
Date: August 15, 2021, 4:44 pm
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Coming back to this thread probably a bit too late, but I wanted
to say, I don’t necessarily think performance after leaving a
club is a definitive indicator of missed potential.
Obviously there’s a lot of factors that go into someone being
successful as a pro rugby player and yes some they’ll bring with
them. But other considerations such as timing of exposure /
opportunity, team balance, positional changes, confidence
building, managing injuries etc, can be controlled or influenced
by the Club bringing the player into the pro game and make a
lasting impression on their career.
Regarding our former Locks; I’m not suggesting any of the
individuals who passed through Quins were potential world
beaters, just that not converting any of half a dozen very
promising young players into senior professionals indicated we
were getting something wrong. I actually think Quins have
addressed the issues, and hope that Lamb, Tizard and Hammond
benefit from it, but it’s something to watch out for. It’s
relatively straightforward to gather a group of useful 18-21
year olds in an Academy, but if they just end up departing at
23/24 it doesn’t take a club much forward.
#Post#: 73135--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: poorfour
Date: August 16, 2021, 5:26 am
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--- Quote from: Somardino link ---
>
> Regarding our former Locks; I’m not suggesting any of the
individuals who passed through Quins were potential world
beaters, just that not converting any of half a dozen very
promising young players into senior professionals indicated we
were getting something wrong. I actually think Quins have
addressed the issues, and hope that Lamb, Tizard and Hammond
benefit from it, but it’s something to watch out for. It’s
relatively straightforward to gather a group of useful 18-21
year olds in an Academy, but if they just end up departing at
23/24 it doesn’t take a club much forward.
>
--- End Quote ---
Running an Academy is not an exact science; players who are
talented at 16 or 18 don't always develop in the ways you might
expect. Launchbury is a classic case - not good enough to make
the cut at 18, but a world class player by his mid 20s. Charlie
Matthews is the flip side of the coin - he had a similar build
and skill set to Launchbury when he first got 1st XV experience,
but wasn't able to add the physicality needed to unlock the
potential in his talent.
The Quins academy (and our recruitment of non-academy players)
has actually had a pretty high hit rate in most positions, but
it goes through cycles. Sometimes you get players who develop
the way you hope, and sometimes you don't. After Robshaw came
through, we've had a mix ranging from those who didn't quite cut
it (York) through solid club players who haven't really
progressed beyond that (Wallace, Chisholm) to Clifford who had
everything to be a top class international except a robust
shoulder. We can only hope that we can keep Kenningham fit and
developing.
The lock cupboard has been a little bare - but for some reason
Quins have never really been able to homegrow locks until now.
Robson was a converted 6 (as is Dino) so Tizard and Hammond are
the exception, not the rule. (As an aside, and as a youth coach,
one observation I'd make is that when we tour to other parts of
the country, they always seem to have bigger tight 5s than we
do. Perhaps its something in the water).
But to emphasise how inexact the science is. Tony Diprose once
told me about three fly half candidates they'd been taking
through the academy. He felt they'd had a pretty good hit rate
from that batch. One was no longer at Quins but had gone on to
the Sevens circuit. One hadn't made the cut. The remaining one -
who wasn't viewed as the best prospect at junior level -
recently became Lion #855.
#Post#: 73160--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: Adrian
Date: August 16, 2021, 1:22 pm
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HTML https://www.premiershiprugby.com/news/ollie-lindsay-hague-signs-for-newcastle-falcons
OLH off to Falcons on a short term deal.
#Post#: 73167--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: The Absolute Quintet
Date: August 16, 2021, 3:59 pm
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Poorfour, like your post, except the Launchbury miss was a
howler as Worthing tipped off Wasps when he was 18, having been
rejected by Diprose. There was a lot wrong with the academy in
those days. It seems a whole lot better since they now play
actual games rather than simply train. Lads coming through the
Quins and junior county system, in Sussex at least, were all
over the place. It was a mess.
#Post#: 73182--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: Quinston Churchill
Date: August 17, 2021, 3:36 am
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Possibly, although it’s a lot easier to describe something like
that as a ‘howler’ with the benefit of hindsight.
I’ve seen several articles over the years where he talks about
not being 100% focused. This is just one example. In his own
words, being let go was ‘disappointing’ but ‘not a shock’. It
really wasn’t as simple as we missed the obvious and he
immediately went to Wasps:
HTML https://www.englandrugby.com/news/article/my-story-joe-launchbury
If anything our mistake was not keeping tabs on him after he’d
left, but it does sound like him being picked up by Wasps
(through a former player) was a fortunate gamble rather than him
being a hot property multiple clubs were looking at.
#Post#: 73187--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: raedarius
Date: August 17, 2021, 4:13 am
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Last time Quins put the player details on the website, there
were something in the order of 100+ players associated with
Quins at U15, training over five or so locations. Each year,
many good players are dropped, some before their final growth
reveals what position they'll be good at. Ultimately, maybe
four to five will get into the academy each year, based in part
on what positions the team anticipate (guess) they'll need in a
few years time.
It can be as simple as - tough luck, you're in the Quins (or
Irish or whoever) catchment area and we don't need locks (or
centres or whatever) this year.
Worth noting as well that someone else probably got dropped from
the Wasps Academy to make room for Launchbury. It's a system
that works for the clubs, not the players. If it was truly
about the players, a national system and a draft would be
better.
#Post#: 73188--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: raedarius
Date: August 17, 2021, 4:17 am
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--- Quote from: raedarius link ---
> It's a system that works for the clubs, not the players. If
it was truly about the players, a national system and a draft
would be better.
>
--- End Quote ---
To be clear, when I say "for the clubs" I mean "on behalf of the
clubs".
#Post#: 73194--------------------------------------------------
Re: Former player news
DIR By: Quinofthestoneage
Date: August 17, 2021, 5:46 am
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I've said it before and I'll say it again. An academy is not
necessarily always the best way to identify and retain talent.
I'm not saying it doesnt help a bit, but it's worth remembering
that two of our best players in the last two years came through
the university route . Similarly, someone like Bayliss at Bath
from the RAF. Players from the lower leagues etc. There are lots
of ways of being a top flight rugby player. Academies are just
one route, and sometimes an inefficient one at that.
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