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#Post#: 51441--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: Yareet
Date: October 9, 2020, 1:48 am
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--- Quote from: deadlyfrom5yardsout link ---
>
> Jammy you are too kind. Were they too just following orders?
Having 10 Internationals on the sidelines must have made one or
two of them wonder, or did they think that everybody was there
on cut price money for the sheer joy of being a Saracen player?
>
--- End Quote ---
Nope. But I can see how they thought everybody was there on cut
price money because that money was topped up through clever
mechanisms which Wray assured them was completely within the
rules.
And given how long those mechanisms were allowed to continue, I
can understand why the players would want to believe Wray.
I have no sympathy for Sarries as a club but perhaps a smidge
for the players who I can see were maybe misled.
#Post#: 51446--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: Surbiton Quin
Date: October 9, 2020, 5:44 am
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I am a long time lurker, first time poster.
Amongst the issues I have with Saracens is that the idea that
the players were all unwitting pawns manipulated by an evil
genius.
Taking a Quins example, James Johnston, we wanted to keep him
and was near the top of our salary band as we could go, he often
played complete matches for us.
He went to Saracens for more money and proceeded to be a bench
player at best with the coaching team saying he was unfit, now
how anyone in the dressing room was unaware of Minty's tweets
and comments and the playing history I don't know.
Likewise when you have 10 or 11 of the most recent Lions in your
squad, who would probably be marquee players elsewhere, plus a
load of other current internationals and still think that you
are under the cap is beyond me.
The question is often personalised so as to make the
laws/rules/sanctions seem cruel and the question asked often is
"would you take away Brad Barritt's medals?" because he's a nice
guy and should keep them being the message.
Yes I would and everybody else's, they knew or with some simple
inquiries or maths had a damn good idea and they all profited
personally by it as did everybody associated with the club. Just
by having better players in a squad raises the overall standards
and improves training and insight for those coming through.
If there is no championship tough they should stay down, on
paper they may be strongest on paper but not all clubs bounce
straight back and on paper Leicester City would never have been
Premiership champions and Japan wouldn't have beaten South
Africa in a World Cup.
#Post#: 51449--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: Only Joe Quin
Date: October 9, 2020, 6:41 am
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Whether or not Brad Barritt is a nice guy is irrelevant, the
medals were awarded for team performance and were obtained by
cheating so none of the players deserve to have them.
#Post#: 51454--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: raedarius
Date: October 9, 2020, 8:47 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Surbiton Quin link ---
>
> I am a long time lurker, first time poster.
>
> Amongst the issues I have with Saracens is that the idea that
the players were all unwitting pawns manipulated by an evil
genius.
>
> Taking a Quins example, James Johnston, we wanted to keep him
and was near the top of our salary band as we could go, he often
played complete matches for us.
>
> He went to Saracens for more money and proceeded to be a bench
player at best with the coaching team saying he was unfit, now
how anyone in the dressing room was unaware of Minty's tweets
and comments and the playing history I don't know.
>
> Likewise when you have 10 or 11 of the most recent Lions in
your squad, who would probably be marquee players elsewhere,
plus a load of other current internationals and still think that
you are under the cap is beyond me.
>
> The question is often personalised so as to make the
laws/rules/sanctions seem cruel and the question asked often is
"would you take away Brad Barritt's medals?" because he's a nice
guy and should keep them being the message.
>
> Yes I would and everybody else's, they knew or with some
simple inquiries or maths had a damn good idea and they all
profited personally by it as did everybody associated with the
club. Just by having better players in a squad raises the
overall standards and improves training and insight for those
coming through.
>
> If there is no championship tough they should stay down, on
paper they may be strongest on paper but not all clubs bounce
straight back and on paper Leicester City would never have been
Premiership champions and Japan wouldn't have beaten South
Africa in a World Cup.
>
--- End Quote ---
The received wisdom is that James Johnson went to Saracens
because he wanted a big money French deal which didn't then
appear, and while he was looking for that French deal, we signed
a 'replacement' in the form of PDJ so he suddenly found himself
without a club. This isn't one that can be pinned on Saracens n
that scenario.
#Post#: 51456--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: Surbiton Quin
Date: October 9, 2020, 9:31 am
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That's not how I remember it, especially given Easter being so
annoyed and there is also the quote from Conor in the rugby
paper
HTML https://www.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/12546/8398009/james-johnston-departure-for-saracens-disappoints-harlequins
"Unfortunately, given the constraints of the salary cap, we were
unable to meet his financial expectations so he has decided to
move on at the end of the current season.
"But I know he will give his all to go out on a high from the
club that has become his extended family and means a great deal
to him.
"We're in the fortunate position of having two of the most
exciting, young tight heads props in the country coming through
our system in Will Collier and Kyle Sinckler and we are
confident that we will be able to recruit another experienced
front row forward to complement them shortly."
So I stand by my earlier post, especially given the amount they
paid for essentially a bench player
#Post#: 51459--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: honkytonk
Date: October 9, 2020, 10:21 am
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JJ didnt leave for more money, in the end!!. He told the club
he was leaving. The club tried to convince him to stay but
could not offer any more. His (or his agents) expectation was
that a big money deal from France would be incoming. It wasnt.
As mentioned above, in the meantime we signed PDJ. When a deal
from France did not materialise, he joined Sarries (we could not
take him back) on pretty much the same money he was on at Quins
in the end. He may have left expecting/wanting more money, but
he never got it from Sarries. Ironic thing is, if he had of
stayed with us, he would probably have got a little more.
The quotes above indicate he left because he wanted more, never
got it.
#Post#: 51460--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: RocQuin
Date: October 9, 2020, 10:54 am
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What a great acquisition PDJ was!!
Marginally less useful than Geo Cronje
#Post#: 51496--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: Aha!
Date: October 11, 2020, 7:02 am
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Perhaps Mike Gooley at Ealing has lawyers in his back pocket
too. He's just sought planning permission to construct an indoor
training Dome for rugby and cricket, with a footprint of
approximately 3,200 m2, adjacent to the current clubhouse and
pitches.
So I suspect he might challenge any Sarries' presumption of
automatic promotion!
(whether Ealing can effectively compete in the premier league is
by the by.)
#Post#: 51497--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: Fearless Fred
Date: October 11, 2020, 7:32 am
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There's an extract from Robert Kitson's new book in todays'
Observer
HTML https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/oct/11/what-exeter-really-think-of-saracens-they-won-those-titles-by-cheating<br
/>that details some of Exeters view about it all...
#Post#: 51498--------------------------------------------------
Re: SalaryCens Lawyers in the starting blocks!
DIR By: honkytonk
Date: October 11, 2020, 7:37 am
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Ealing are apparently bringing in a couple more players. They
are going to give it a good go next season
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