DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
ComeAllWithin (Harlequins Rugby)
HTML https://comeallwithin.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: ComeAllWithin Board
*****************************************************
#Post#: 48921--------------------------------------------------
What's working / what isn't
DIR By: poorfour
Date: September 8, 2020, 6:56 am
---------------------------------------------------------
With 5 games under our belts, and a bit of distance since
Saturday, I thought it would be useful to look at what's working
and what isn't in our current game. I haven't rewatched the game
on telly, so I am going by what I saw in the ground, and what I
saw in previous games.
What's NOT working
- The scrum. This is particularly disappointing; we have the
resources to put out a good scrum, and when we have managed to
get on the right side of the ref we have been effective. But in
most games we have consistently been on the wrong side of the
whistle. Whether that's right or not is another question - I
thought Obano was repeatedly hinging and Foley got most of his
calls wrong - but we need to fix whatever is going wrong because
we have to have primary possession.
- The kick off. Two of Bath's tries - the difference in the
scoreline - came from failing to handle the kick off. I am not
sure if that was a blip or a more persistent problem
- Passing. It's been a feature of several games that we've
started good moves and created space only for the final pass to
ruin it all. This has tended to happen when we've been on the
losing side of the scoreboard, so it may be a general composure
issue.
- Silly mistakes. We've repeatedly got ourselves into promising
positions and then let the opposition off the hook through
errors and penalties
- Scramble defence. The basic defensive pattern is ok - for the
first 20 minutes or so, Bath were making little progress in
attack and were content to take penalties until we started
gifting them tries. But if a runner beats the first tackle, we
tend to concede a lot of ground before we react to close it down
Mixed bag
- The breakdown. I was tempted to put this under not working,
but my feeling is that we have won our share of breakdowns when
we keep our structure and have support in place; Evans has been
consistently good
- The lineout. Has been very variable, but it worked well on
Saturday, Young took the most lineouts of anyone across all the
games, and we disrupted theirs a couple of times. We can hope
that it's on an upwards curve
- Penetration in midfield. We are a much better team when Lasike
is on the field, but we can't use him all the time. Fingers
crossed that Andre the Giant will be able to share the role.
This I think is where we most feel the loss of Sinckler -
without a focus point for the opposition defence, we're less
able to use our outside backs
What's working
There actually are a few things...
- Tactical kicking. Our kicking has generally been pretty
effective. Herron copped a lot of flak at the weekend but he put
several tricky kicks into the corner. Which we typically failed
to convert, but there you go.
- Running lines / attack when we hold onto the ball. When we
don't drop the ball or make silly mistakes, the lines that Long
is coaching are causing trouble for defences. In the early part
of the game, when we actually had possession, we were making
inroads into Bath's defence with most phases. But the lack of
composure / interplay between the team is killing those moves at
the moment. The question is whether it will improve - the thing
we have to bear in mind is that Marchant, Earle and Brown have
been out for a long time so we are seeing combinations who have
not played together much (though ironically Ashton has hit his
stride immediately). If it starts to improve over the next few
games, there's cause for optimism.
- Offloads and support when we make a break. This has generally
been good, especially between Dombrandt, Brown and Ashton
- Individual contributions: Evans, Robshaw, Steele, Lasike,
Ashton and Brown have generally looked sharp even when we
haven't been playing well.
#Post#: 48927--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: never sleep
Date: September 8, 2020, 7:06 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I think the lineout functions differently depending on who is
there.
Put Youngs in as a jumper. He is a bit lighter to throw up in
the air and he wins most.
- but, on defending, he is not so good as his maul defence is
average (probably due to his size)
Ella - Not so good at hitting his mark. Needs to throw short.
But excellent in the catch and drive maul (both attach and
defence)
Gray - very good arrows. But needs a jumper who is on the same
page
Baldwin - sometimes good - sometimes average
- so, start with Gray and Youngs and you will often get a good
lineout - but, the oppo may often score from attacking lineouts.
I think that Ella+Youngs would be best. But then you have to
have 3 other 1st choice players in the tight 5.
#Post#: 48936--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: Comet
Date: September 8, 2020, 7:39 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Thank you for the analysis in the original post. I really like
your thinking.
I agree with what you have said. We do give away such silly
tries, it is so frustrating that we work so hard to score tries
and the opposition are gifted points. That has been a problem
all season.
I am also a bit concerned about our composure. I think we have
the skills to throw it around and create the space for our
flyers but, on Saturday, too many passes went behind or too far
above the man. It was a shame because I would really like for
that style to be our identity; it fits the way we see ourselves,
I would say.
#Post#: 48938--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: Guildford Quin
Date: September 8, 2020, 8:03 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Lineouts and driving mauls have improved - thank you Jerry
Flannery. Scrums are solid with a 1st choice Front & 2nd Row,
but the second choices are struggling. Our success at
Breakdowns/Turnovers seems to depend on whether our lightweight
backrow get outmuscled by a bigger pack. Some good attacking
lines to create opportunities in the backs, and the offloading
game traditionally suits Quins style but we don't appear to have
the accuracy at the moment, some of which maybe down to
necessary selection changes or lack of composure.
#Post#: 48940--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: Nico Wilson
Date: September 8, 2020, 8:07 am
---------------------------------------------------------
PoorFour - an excellent piece. Thank you. Good to read something
that is well balanced.
#Post#: 48958--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: Quinston Churchill
Date: September 8, 2020, 12:04 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Composure and execution are well below par and it’s an issue
we’ve had for a long time and I think they’re symptomatic of
some psychological barriers we have.
The pattern of the games we lose is often very similar:
- We start well, build a lead and then someone makes a silly
mistake, we lose confidence and implode (much like we did
against Bath)
- We start badly, heads quickly drop and the game is gone. We
make a late rally that makes the scoreline respectable and
somehow think that makes it OK (see Saracens)
I’ve used the most recent examples, but you could easily change
the teams for other fixtures and see the same patterns.
We often go into games with the wrong mentality and the changes
in our mood is so visible. When our heads drop it’s so obvious
and easy for opponents to take advantage.
I don’t know the solution, but I’m sure a lot of it is the
mental side rather ability-related.
#Post#: 48959--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: Bucksquin
Date: September 8, 2020, 12:17 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Quinston Churchill link ---
>
> Composure and execution are well below par and it’s an issue
we’ve had for a long time and I think they’re symptomatic of
some psychological barriers we have.
>
> The pattern of the games we lose is often very similar:
>
> - We start well, build a lead and then someone makes a silly
mistake, we lose confidence and implode (much like we did
against Bath)
>
> - We start badly, heads quickly drop and the game is gone. We
make a late rally that makes the scoreline respectable and
somehow think that makes it OK (see Saracens)
>
> I’ve used the most recent examples, but you could easily
change the teams for other fixtures and see the same patterns.
>
> We often go into games with the wrong mentality and the
changes in our mood is so visible. When our heads drop it’s so
obvious and easy for opponents to take advantage.
>
> I don’t know the solution, but I’m sure a lot of it is the
mental side rather ability-related.
>
--- End Quote ---
Might not the problem (which you set out very well) be largely
related, in both instances (yet masked to some extent when we
start well, when energy levels are high and we might get a lucky
break or two in attack), to our consistent inability to
physically dominate a game through the forwards? Isn't that
where we are always going wrong?
#Post#: 48963--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: Mayor West
Date: September 8, 2020, 1:38 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Some good observations about our team. The theme seems to be
that the problem is mental. Could it be as simple as not having
enough leaders to pull the team along and chivvy them up. Or not
enough players who stay focused when plans don’t go right. Do we
need a talisman who the players will follow anywhere? The
coaches know what’s wrong but why won’t/don’t the players play
as they’re coached.
#Post#: 48971--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: Comet
Date: September 8, 2020, 3:31 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Mayor West link ---
>
> Some good observations about our team. The theme seems to be
that the problem is mental. Could it be as simple as not having
enough leaders to pull the team along and chivvy them up. Or not
enough players who stay focused when plans don’t go right. Do we
need a talisman who the players will follow anywhere? The
coaches know what’s wrong but why won’t/don’t the players play
as they’re coached.
>
--- End Quote ---
Really good thoughts. I tend to think it is a focus issue. When
we concede, we tend to let quite a few points slip away in a
short period of time. I would say we have been like that for
years but last season we definitely were a bit mentally tougher.
We rarely got hammered.
Can Chisholm, Dombrandt and Smith be the leaders in the (near)
future? I think so from a skills and desire point of view. I
just hope that they are inspirational to the rest of the team.
Or, rather, the rest of the team are inspired by them.
#Post#: 48995--------------------------------------------------
Re: What's working / what isn't
DIR By: quinalan
Date: September 9, 2020, 5:46 am
---------------------------------------------------------
For me, when we get our best 15 on the pitch & properly focused
on winning an important game, they usually stand up & win well.
The problem is, as has been pointed out in the other thread,
getting the rest of the squad when they come in, to play at that
equivalent level. So how do we work with the squad players to
improve them as players & perhaps improve the mental side of
their game?
*****************************************************
Page 1 of 2
DIR Next Page