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#Post#: 48873--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: Quinston Churchill
Date: September 7, 2020, 7:07 am
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Right now, I’d have depth as one of our big weaknesses. Even if
we were performing better, the quality of our players beyond the
first XV is a lot lower. Having 3 more players who will either
make the starting lineup or the 23 is a big deal.
Kerrod has been a good signing but Louw will at worst provide
better competition than Collier has been and will hopefully be
an upgrade on Kerrod who is already good.
Esterhuizen is better than any of our other options at 12 and
I’m confident that Green will be good enough to challenge for a
place in the starting XV and is at worst, a big upgrade on
Morris and Ross Chisholm.
Aside from all of that, the psychological boost of having an
injection of additional quality might just be what we need after
what’s been a mostly poor re-start.
#Post#: 48875--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: KentQuin
Date: September 7, 2020, 8:16 am
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--- Quote from: Quinston Churchill link ---
>
> Right now, I’d have depth as one of our big weaknesses. Even
if we were performing better, the quality of our players beyond
the first XV is a lot lower.
>
--- End Quote ---
Correct. This is one of the biggest factors behind our
inconsistency. There's no real pressure on first XV players and
that's essential to drive standards. Too many of our players are
comfortable. At an Exeter (or dare I say Sarries), if you play
poorly you might not get the shirt back for a month.
#Post#: 48877--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: never sleep
Date: September 7, 2020, 8:36 am
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--- Quote from: marlowish link ---
>
> Agreed totally, but Quins are either not able or prepared to
spend the money required to assemble a team of high quality
players.
>
--- End Quote ---
I personally don't like the approach of going out and just
buying 15 players and shoving them in Quins shirts.
I want the players to be Harlequins. i.e. to have some
connection to the club. Basically, Ugos, Browns, Chisholms,
Dombrandts, etc.
Ideally, I would like to see a core bunch of academy players
with marquee signings in key positions - e.g. scrum half or Nick
Evans, etc.
In my opinion, this approach ultimately won us the premiership -
as it did with Exeter and Saints, etc. I think it would again -
but it takes time to achieve.
#Post#: 48878--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: never sleep
Date: September 7, 2020, 9:05 am
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Just to follow up on this - I picked an A-League team from 2
years ago - only 4 are still here.
For info, I think this team got us through to the final.
15. Tim Swiel
14. Ross Chisholm
13. Harry Sloan
12. Henry Cheeseman
11. Gabriel Ibitoye
10. James Lang
9. Calum Waters
1. Lewis Boyce
2. Max Crumpton
3. Phil Swainston
4. John Okafor
5. Josh Ibuanokpe
6. Stan South (c)
7. Archie White
8. Dino Lamb
#Post#: 48879--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: KentQuin
Date: September 7, 2020, 9:26 am
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--- Quote from: never sleep link ---
>
> Ideally, I would like to see a core bunch of academy players
with marquee signings in key positions - e.g. scrum half or Nick
Evans, etc.
>
--- End Quote ---
I wholeheartedly agree and think most fans would too. We're
pretty good at bringing players through and at recruiting
relative unknowns (e.g. Dombrandt). It's when we do splash the
cash that we seem to get it wrong, or just have rotten luck
through injury. I think in the last decade Nev is our only
marquee signing who has lived up to expectations.
#Post#: 48883--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: A222Quin
Date: September 7, 2020, 10:29 am
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--- Quote from: KentQuin link ---
>
> I wholeheartedly agree and think most fans would too. We're
pretty good at bringing players through and at recruiting
relative unknowns (e.g. Dombrandt). It's when we do splash the
cash that we seem to get it wrong, or just have rotten luck
through injury. I think in the last decade Nev is our only
marquee signing who has lived up to expectations.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
Definitely so in the past, however I think we probably overstate
how good we are at bringing players through, particularly in
recent years. How many recent graduates from the academy have
slotted into the match day 23 in recent times?
#Post#: 48885--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: never sleep
Date: September 7, 2020, 11:40 am
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--- Quote from: A222Quin link ---
>
> How many recent graduates from the academy have slotted into
the match day 23 in recent times?
>
--- End Quote ---
Looking at the team I posted from 2 years ago, only Lang appears
consistently on the bench. Occasionally Lamb or White will
appear. But not very often. I think we have moved away from
developing. I suspect that Lamb and White will need to move on
to develop (as Merrick has done)
#Post#: 48888--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: Quinston Churchill
Date: September 7, 2020, 2:50 pm
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How have we ‘moved away from developing’? That simply isn’t
true.
In recent years (i.e. not the likes of Robshaw or Brown), we’ve
brought through a good number of our current squad such as
Smith, Marchant, James Chisholm, Murley, White and Lamb. But for
Clifford and Saunders’ retirements, we’d have had another two
and TBH, if COVID-19 hadn’t come along, I like to think we’d
have kept Ibitoye too. We then have a number in the current
academy crop who are likely to be promoted next season (such as
Baxter or Lynagh).
I think we can also take credit for taking a chance on Dombrandt
and Northmore who were not from another club’s academy.
Does any of that sound like a club unwilling to develop players?
If you look around the Premiership, even the clubs with a strong
English core - most of them are not academy players like ours.
#Post#: 48892--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: Quinston Churchill
Date: September 8, 2020, 2:16 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: never sleep link ---
>
> Just to follow up on this - I picked an A-League team from 2
years ago - only 4 are still here.
> For info, I think this team got us through to the final.
>
> 15. Tim Swiel
> 14. Ross Chisholm
> 13. Harry Sloan
> 12. Henry Cheeseman
> 11. Gabriel Ibitoye
> 10. James Lang
> 9. Calum Waters
> 1. Lewis Boyce
> 2. Max Crumpton
> 3. Phil Swainston
> 4. John Okafor
> 5. Josh Ibuanokpe
> 6. Stan South (c)
> 7. Archie White
> 8. Dino Lamb
>
--- End Quote ---
OK, so from this XV, which of the players that have left do you
think would improve our 23?
3 at the most IMO - Ibitoye, Boyce and Crumpton.
AFAIK, we did not want to lose any of those. Boyce got a decent
amount of game time for us but decided he’d prefer to be Obano’s
understudy for more money. Gabs, we’ve covered at length
elsewhere and Crumpton was a retirement.
None of the rest are really good enough to be regular
Premiership players. Yes, Saracens signed Sloan and big Josh,
but I think that’s in the knowledge that they’ll be playing in
the Championship next season.
#Post#: 48896--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gustard Out
DIR By: deadlyfrom5yardsout
Date: September 8, 2020, 3:31 am
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My wife suggested that all those dodgy offloads probably worked
perfectly on the training ground without aggressive oppo.
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