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#Post#: 35938--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: MadMax
Date: January 17, 2020, 7:23 am
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--- Quote from: TeddingtonQuin link ---
>
> I'm keen to know how much Gustard knew about it...
>
--- End Quote ---
My bet is a lot. He was in charge of recruitment there wasn't
he?
Nigel Wray has rightly come in for a lot of flak for his part in
the cheating and there seems no doubt he was the main instigator
but there are many others who were silently complicit in my
opinion.
#Post#: 35942--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: InsertQuinsPunHere
Date: January 17, 2020, 7:57 am
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--- Quote from: TeddingtonQuin link ---
>
> I'm keen to know how much Gustard knew about it...
>
--- End Quote ---
I have a vague memory of him being asked a salary cap question
at a QUINSSA event in February last year. Maybe someone with a
better recall of what happened can jump in, but didn't he raise
an eyebrow in a conspiratorial fashion, mutter something
non-committal, and promptly change the subject?
#Post#: 35944--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Quinten Poulsen
Date: January 17, 2020, 8:10 am
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--- Quote from: MadMax link ---
>
> True but then again we all thought Saracens were cheating the
salary cap didn't we? And all we could do was think. But we
thought correctly.
>
> Any player with a basic grasp of maths could look at his
salary and work out what was happening even if he didn't have
the actual proof to hand.
>
--- End Quote ---
So what would you realistically expect a player to do, assuming
he thinks they're above the cap but has zero evidence?
#Post#: 35945--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Quinten Poulsen
Date: January 17, 2020, 8:12 am
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Does anyone think the coaching staff were involved in
negotiations with regards to the co-investments?
#Post#: 35947--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Bolly-Quin
Date: January 17, 2020, 8:35 am
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--- Quote from: Quinten Poulsen link ---
>
> Does anyone think the coaching staff were involved in
negotiations with regards to the co-investments?
>
--- End Quote ---
I would doubt it - their game is coaching, not coaxing..
#Post#: 35948--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: DOK
Date: January 17, 2020, 8:48 am
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The Times article
Saracens must cut wages by £2 million – or be relegated
Threat of automatic demotion over salary cap
Owen Slot, Chief Rugby Correspondent | Alex Lowe, Deputy Rugby
Correspondent
January 17 2020, 12:00pm, The Times
Saracens are facing automatic relegation from the Premiership at
the end of this season if they fail to reduce their wage bill by
£2 million before the end of the month.
The club’s breach of the salary-cap regulations was so extensive
that they initially agreed to the figure but it now appears
pretty much impossible for them to meet their pledge.
The salary cap is set at £7 million. Saracens were fined £5.36
million and docked 35 league points after an investigation
revealed they broke the salary-cap regulations in each of the
previous three seasons. But Saracens will only be deemed to be
compliant with the cap this season if they can reduce their
wages by £2 million.
Initially the new chief executive, Ed Griffiths, was bullish
that he could shop his players around on the market and cut
spending accordingly. However, having been in the job for a
fortnight, he has discovered that this is almost impossible.
Saracens had initially been given until the close of play today
to show how they were going to come in under cap and to satisfy
a number of demands by the other Premiership clubs. One of those
demands was that Nigel Wray, the chairman, would resign. That
did indeed happen last week. Today the players arrived at
training only to be told to take the morning off and return in
the afternoon.
Bringing down the wage bill looks extremely unlikely. The
highest paid player at the club is Owen Farrell, who earns
£750,000. There are a number of other players earning around
£500,000. Saracens would therefore need a big clear-out to cut
costs by £2 million.
One problem is that most of the other clubs have spent up to the
salary cap limit anyway and therefore cannot squeeze any more
players in. Another problem is that the players may not wish to
leave anyway. When the players were being shopped around to
other clubs, it is unlikely that they even knew they were up for
sale.
Although the full judgement has not been published, those who
have read it say it is damning. The club had initially insisted
after the guilty verdict that they would be under the cap for
this season, arguing the breaches had all been due to one-off
business arrangements with senior players such as Maro Itoje and
Owen Farrell.
Premiership clubs are usually audited under salary-cap
regulations at the end of the season. The Times revealed in
December that Premiership Rugby would take the extraordinary
step of monitoring Saracens mid- season, in recognition of the
need to restore faith in the league. Wray, who also resigned as
a club director yesterday, is understood to have been against
opening the books to Deloitte for a forensic audit.
The club then radically changed its position when Griffiths was
appointed as interim chief executive earlier this month. He
admitted that Saracens were on course to break the cap again and
that urgent cuts would be required to the wage bill.
This latest remarkable twist to the tale indicates that the rest
of the Premiership is still not satisfied that Saracens will be
compliant. All clubs were represented at a meeting on Tuesday,
with Bruce Craig, the Bath owner, joining via a video link from
the Caribbean.
Griffiths is understood to have been calling around rival
Premiership clubs in a bid to offload players that would help
bring down the Saracens wage bill but has been struggling to
find takers. Very few clubs are believed to have the budget or
space in their own caps. It is unclear what mechanism PRL would
use to relegate Saracens. One source said last night that the
Tuesday meeting amounted to a disciplinary hearing. Another said
Saracens would have to take voluntary relegation if they did not
come back next week with the right solution.
The Times revealed this month that Saracens could have been
deducted 70 points — which would have almost certainly relegated
them — because two of the three breaches were in excess of
£650,000. The independent panel decided that the two 35-point
penalties should run concurrently.
Saracens initially threatened to appeal, provoking fury around
the league, with clubs calling for them to be relegated and have
their titles removed.
Neither of those actions was permissible under the regulations,
nor was the publication of the full report which detailed how
and to what extent Saracens broke the rules. Lord Dyson said
last week that he believed the judgement should be published
because it was in the public interest.
Griffiths had said that his mission was to make Saracens appear
“whiter than white” and he acknowledged that mistakes had been
made. “We will deal with it,” he had promised. “It is an easy
thing to say — we are going to be compliant — but you need to
back up words with actions.”
Saracens have been exploring whether Liam Williams, the Wales
full back, could join Scarlets before the end of this season
rather than in the summer but no arrangement has yet been
reached. Richard Wigglesworth, Brad Barritt and Alex Lozowski
are among the senior players out of contract in the summer,
while George Kruis is due to leave at the end of the season
although that does not help them solve the immediate crisis.
How the salary cap scandal unfolded and led to sanctions
March 4 A Daily Mail investigation reveals that Saracens have
set up co-investment schemes between Nigel Wray, then the
chairman, and a number of star players.
March 11 Wray declares “investment is not salary” and “the club
is open and transparent with the salary-cap manager and we
proactively disclose co-investments even though we are under no
obligation to do so.”
April 10 Premiership Rugby announces a review into Saracens
after it is found club did not disclose all details of the
co-investments.
September 3 Matter passed to a specialist arbitrators firm.
October 26 Saracens group head of finance, Bernard van Zyl
leaves the club, along with fellow director Nick Leslau.
November 5 Saracens are docked 35 points and fined £5.3 million
after being found guilty of salary-cap breach.
January 2 Wray stands down as chairman. Ed Griffiths, who left
after first the salary-cap scandal in 2015, returns as interim
chief executive.
#Post#: 35950--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: honkytonk
Date: January 17, 2020, 8:52 am
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Id take Singleton on injury dispensation. We could fit him in
that way. Likewise Lozowski to cover centre/10.
#Post#: 35951--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Rocker
Date: January 17, 2020, 9:05 am
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They should be relegated to Level 9 like Scottish and Richmond!
#Post#: 35952--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Guildford Quin
Date: January 17, 2020, 9:06 am
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Whilst I have no sympathy for their self-inflicted predicament,
I do wonder if it was ever possible for them to remain within
the cap this season, whether they were £650k or £2m over budget
? Most Premiership clubs had finalised their squads for this
season when the punishment was announced and the majority are
probably spending upto the cap. With the exception of injury
dispensation there would be little opportunity for a move to
another English club even at a discounted wage and the EQP's in
their squad would resist an overseas move. Any severance
payments to the players or contract buy-outs by other clubs
contribute to the cap. How could they have turned it around
before July ?
#Post#: 35954--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: never sleep
Date: January 17, 2020, 9:10 am
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There are probably clubs not spending up to the cap.
But, as we know, only Chiefs are actually making money and I
doubt that they need any Sarries players.
So, if a team that was under the cap did want to take on a
player, then they would have to go and borrow money to do so.
I'm not sure that this would be a wise investment.
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